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Ash writes: "Fairly quickly the commercial press is going to turn the NSA domestic spying story into a fox-hunt for Edward Snowden. A very public high-speed chase will serve to paint Snowden as a criminal and, of equal or greater value, divert attention from what Snowden exposed."

Edward Snowden, the whistleblower who leaked top secret documents revealing a vast surveillance program by the US government to the Guardian newspaper. (photo: Guardian UK)
Edward Snowden, the whistleblower who leaked top secret documents revealing a vast surveillance program by the US government to the Guardian newspaper. (photo: Guardian UK)


What Snowden Said

By Marc Ash, Reader Supported News

11 June 13

 

airly quickly the commercial press is going to turn the NSA domestic spying story into a fox-hunt for Edward Snowden.

A very public high-speed chase will serve to paint Snowden as a criminal and, of equal or greater value, divert attention from what Snowden exposed.

Before the chase scene begins it bears noting what Edward Snowden said, and the sacrifice that he made.

  • "I will be satisfied if the federation of secret law, unequal pardon and irresistible executive powers that rule the world that I love are revealed even for an instant."

  • "I really want the focus to be on these documents and the debate which I hope this will trigger among citizens around the globe about what kind of world we want to live in ... My sole motive is to inform the public as to that which is done in their name and that which is done against them."

  • [Communicating with Washington Post reporter Barton Gellman]: The U.S. intelligence community, he wrote, "will most certainly kill you if they think you are the single point of failure that could stop this disclosure and make them the sole owner of this information."

  • "I had full access to the full rosters of everyone working at the NSA, the entire intelligence community, and undercover assets all around the world … Any analyst at any time can target anyone … I, sitting at my desk, certainly have the authorities to wiretap anyone - from you or your accountant, to a federal judge, to even the President."

  • "The government has granted itself power it is not entitled to. There is no public oversight. The result is people like myself have the latitude to go further than they are allowed to."

  • "I'm willing to sacrifice all of that because I can't in good conscience allow the US government to destroy privacy, internet freedom and basic liberties for people around the world with this massive surveillance machine they're secretly building."

  • "I don't see myself as a hero," he said, "because what I'm doing is self-interested: I don't want to live in a world where there's no privacy and therefore no room for intellectual exploration and creativity."

Marc Ash was formerly the founder and Executive Director of Truthout, and is now founder and Editor of Reader Supported News.

Reader Supported News is the Publication of Origin for this work. Permission to republish is freely granted with credit and a link back to Reader Supported News.

 

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-72 # MidwestTom 2013-06-11 11:59
Also to divert attention from the IRS mess, and the NSA mess.
 
 
+33 # SundownLF 2013-06-11 12:13
Oh, my - how could you have forgotten Benghazi?
 
 
+77 # NanFan 2013-06-11 12:27
Quoting MidwestTom:
Also to divert attention from the IRS mess, and the NSA mess.


No, no. We must remember that this is not just about the US. The World community of leaders is looking VERY closely at what the US has been doing and what that means to the privacy of their citizens. This whole thing spans FAR beyond the US citizenry being under surveillance.

This is a World-wide technology issue that WILL be addressed and put the US government under the microscope it needed to be under since the inception of The Patriot Act.

Whether Mr. Snowden thinks of himself as a hero or not, what he has done is an immeasurable service to the World: he has pulled back the shade that has cloaked the window into the way the US government really operates, who they really are. They have created an ersatz democracy where no one is ever truly "free."

I thank him, but fear for him. Laws should change and heads should roll but one of them should never be Mr. Snowden's.

N.
 
 
+30 # davidh7426 2013-06-11 13:33
Quoting NanFan:


...The World community of leaders is looking VERY closely at what the US has been doing and what that means to the privacy of their citizens. ...


Some of them looking because of outrage and concern. Others, like the UK government, to see just how much they're implicated in this, and just what they'll have to do to 'get out from under it'.

Either way, does anybody here really think anything will change, the NSA may get a good kicking and go and cry in the corner for a while, but the GAME will go on, this time with tighter security, and a new set of shadowy players.

But the players at the top, won't be touched, they won't even be noticed, it's just another round in the game they're playing.
 
 
+12 # Lowflyin Lolana 2013-06-11 16:18
Davidh7426, You're depressing the hell out of me because I fear you are right.
 
 
+3 # davidh7426 2013-06-11 17:07
Sorry, that wasn't my intent :(
 
 
-32 # BradFromSalem 2013-06-11 12:28
Tom, you forgot the most horrible, nefarious criminal that the Obama administration could have used to divert attention away from an upcoming election and in due time lead to the Coronation of Queen Hillary I of Rodham. I am talking about Ben Gazee (sic), of course
.
 
 
+58 # dickbd 2013-06-11 13:01
Well, you're wrong there, as this is part of the NSA. Besides, can't we make this about principles instead of about personalities?

Both sides are culpable in this. The principle is that we don't want a government that keeps everything secret from its citizens and yet provides very little privacy to them. Shouldn't that be the other way around? If we continue on this path, we are assured of a dictatorship.

And one of the ways the government gets new power is to scare the daylights out of its citizens. Let's try not to scare so easily. My baloney detector goes up every time that I hear someone being demonized. It's not a hundred percent right, but it is at least eighty percent of the time pure baloney or an intended distraction.
 
 
+23 # Eldon J. Bloedorn 2013-06-11 13:26
All he was saying is the government is becoming too powerful and there are insufficient checks and balances to this power grab.
 
 
-16 # HowardMH 2013-06-11 14:56
I don't think Snowden had the brains to time anything. But then again WHY just WHY would our stupid government give a Top Secret Security Clearance to a guy that did not finish high school, and got kicked out of the Army after 5 months?

Stupid is as stupid does and we got a whole lot of Stupid Government out there.
 
 
+13 # ghostperson 2013-06-11 20:23
Most of the mid-20th century tycoons E.g. Bill Leer had 8th grade educations. Book learning and high intellect are not synonymous.
 
 
+9 # RLF 2013-06-12 05:58
For example, our constitutional freedoms are right at this moment being degraded by a Harvard, honors, constitutional scholar! Nuff said!
 
 
+11 # Aaron Tovish 2013-06-12 03:08
Quoting HowardMH:
I don't think Snowden had the brains to time anything. But then again WHY just WHY would our stupid government give a Top Secret Security Clearance to a guy that did not finish high school, and got kicked out of the Army after 5 months?

Stupid is as stupid does and we got a whole lot of Stupid Government out there.


Swondon may be a lot of things, but he clearly is not stupid. I hope he remains free for a good while longer so that we might benefit from his insight.
 
 
+4 # karenvista 2013-06-12 21:58
Quoting HowardMH:
I don't think Snowden had the brains to time anything. But then again WHY just WHY would our stupid government give a Top Secret Security Clearance to a guy that did not finish high school, and got kicked out of the Army after 5 months?


Bill Gates and Steve Jobs didn't finish their educations either. Just because someone doesn't have the pieces of paper to hang on his wall is no indicator of intelligence. He was obviously bright enough to become proficient as a systems administrator.

The fact that he broke both legs during military training exercises is no reason to ridicule him.

Those who cast such personal aspersions should be more thoughtful. For instance, you missed the fact that Snowden was given his security clearance by the contractor, Booz Allen, not the NSA.

The questions shouldn't be about Mr. Snowden's personal attributes, they should be about the behavior of the NSA and the massive amount of contracting to private entities and the fact that there can be no congressional oversight of such gross misbehavior.
 
 
+2 # hammermann 2013-06-13 04:25
He was "kicked out" of the Army after breaking both legs in a training accident, (supposedly special forces). That could mean he wasn't tremendously competent, or they had him doing something dangerous without proper training. Either way I'd say he sacrificed for his country. I find his education amazing too, but obviously he is a computer genius, and extremely well self-taught, I suspect he's far more erudite than you. You could call Bill Gates a college drop-out or the (former) richest man in the world. And in "security", meaning the tendency to remain blindly loyal, no matter what you side is doing, lack of education is an asset. Smarter people think for themselves, and always have some doubts.
 
 
+10 # Aaron Tovish 2013-06-12 03:12
You are all falling straight into the diversion trap!! Obsessed with what we are being diverted from rather than focusing on the monster he has flushed into the open.
Focus on THIS: everyone involved in this is saying "it's legal." That's because they MADE it legal. So that is not defense whatsoever, at least politically. ANYONE who had a hand in making this 'legal' should pay the political price of being through our of office. And of course it should be made ILLEGAL.
 
 
+56 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 12:18
The fact is that the NSA, just like all the organizations created by the so-called "Patriot" Act, are doing EVERYTHING THEY CAN GET AWAY WITH. They will always do that.

Technology will continue to become more powerful for the rest of our lives. This will make it easier for them to go way beyond what they've already done. They ARE listening to everything you say on the phone and online. SOON they'll be listening to everything you say - PERIOD.

If we don't stop this unconstitutiona l intrusion NOW, by the time they are listening to everything that passes from your lips it will be too late to complain.

We've been on a VERY slippery slope since September 2001.
 
 
-6 # Johnny 2013-06-11 13:26
Actually, Bill Clinton signed the slippery AEDPA in 1996.
 
 
-5 # RLF 2013-06-12 06:00
Clinton! What a dick!
 
 
+1 # dickbd 2013-06-13 14:37
That's right, he did. He did a lot of other bad things, too, like deciding that Iraq needed a regime change. He started the no fly zones, and what that means is sending fighter jets and bombers in to fire at will. All of this type of thing is not only immoral, it is counterproducti ve because it foments resentment and hatred--and that leads to terrorists!

I think Clinton's heart was in the right place, and he is a smart guy. But it goes to show that even the best and brightest get sucked into bad policies. I think that's partly because the government is filled by arrogant people. Here, I am thinking mainly of the CIA, FBI, and other agencies like that, where hubris rules. And that's bad for our country, as these people influence the executive branch--and Congress!
 
 
+24 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 14:17
That should have read, "The fact is that the NSA, [AND] all the organizations created by the so-called "Patriot" Act, are doing everything they can get away with"

I realize the NSA is older than the "Patriot" Act. Of course it's reach has become disproportionat e since the "Patriot" Act was enacted.
 
 
+17 # NanFan 2013-06-11 14:33
Quoting Billy Bob:
The fact is that the NSA, just like all the organizations created by the so-called "Patriot" Act, are doing EVERYTHING THEY CAN GET AWAY WITH. They will always do that.

Technology will continue to become more powerful for the rest of our lives. This will make it easier for them to go way beyond what they've already done. They ARE listening to everything you say on the phone and online. SOON they'll be listening to everything you say - PERIOD.

If we don't stop this unconstitutional intrusion NOW, by the time they are listening to everything that passes from your lips it will be too late to complain.

We've been on a VERY slippery slope since September 2001.


Right you are, Billy Bob. And I just read -- on my "smart phone" (love that contradiction) -- that the ACLU is suing the Obama administration "over collection of phone logs," saying that this activity by the NSA is "illegal."

We'll see. Your lips to the powers that be's ears. I think only, only if this surveillance hits the pockets of Wall Street and it's stock traders will anything truly be done to quell this madness of wiretapping the World.

N.
 
 
+2 # RLF 2013-06-12 06:01
Only took the ACLU 13 years to finally sue over the most egregious crimes against our rights in quite a while. Not since their friend of the court in citizen united have they been so pathetic!
 
 
+1 # NanFan 2013-06-12 10:03
Quoting RLF:
Only took the ACLU 13 years to finally sue over the most egregious crimes against our rights in quite a while. Not since their friend of the court in citizen united have they been so pathetic!


True, RLF, but I think they needed an opening that was as HUGE as this is to get a viable case that would sweep to the top. Snowden just did that for them, big time. Think of it...Bradley Manning wasn't even enough.

The ACLU is all about whether they can win a constitutional case. I've been trying to get them to sue the FDA for lack of ministerial duty in not regulating out the toxic ingredients put into US-blended tobacco products one smokes legally, and they will not touch it...NOT YET...because they do not see it as a "winnable" OR a "constitutional " issue.

It's sad it takes them so long, if they get there at all, but in this case, at least they saw the opening and did it. I think this could easily spur the Supreme Court to start "looking" for real. I hope!!

N.
 
 
+4 # karenvista 2013-06-12 22:04
Quoting NanFan:
I think only, only if this surveillance hits the pockets of Wall Street and it's stock traders will anything truly be done to quell this madness of wiretapping the World.N.


Do we have any reason to think that this giant sinkhole of communications is not being used by the people who have access to it for insider trading information?

Are a lot of people becoming even richer than before? For instance, the Carlyle Group, owner of Booz Allen?
 
 
+1 # hammermann 2013-06-13 04:32
Yeah, that's who they should target- they could have put all of Wall St. in prison if they listened to their mortgage scams on the phones over the last decade. Or they could have just got very rich- gee wonder which happened?
 
 
+51 # Trueblue Democrat 2013-06-11 12:24
"Fairly quickly the commercial press is going to turn the NSA domestic spying story into a fox-hunt for Edward Snowden."

Yes, it will, but it will also denigrate him, just as it did other whistle-blowers and the Occupy movement.

It has already started. Yesterday, CBS Evening News led off with this: "Snowden worked at the agency as a low level employee of a contractor. He went to high school in Maryland but did not graduate. He enlisted in the army in May of 2004 but was discharged less than 5 months later."

See, Snowden was a high school drop out. An Army misfit. A bum.

All the ditto-heads out there just drinking in Scott Pelly consigning Snowden to the ash heap, never asking themselves: "If this is so, how did he get hired by an NSA contractor? How did he get in position to expose the feds deepest secrets?"

Good questions, which will not asked by many, and will definitely not be answered by the MSM.
 
 
+2 # Johnny 2013-06-11 13:27
Yep, and today the Zionist Washington Post is running a story about Snowden's alleged girl friend.
 
 
+3 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 15:55
Zionist? Explain
 
 
+41 # fractivist 2013-06-11 12:55
Though Snowden may look and act like Jesus, it breaks my heart to think he may be treated to the same crucifying experience Bradley Manning has had to endure. There must be a way to keep him safe, right? Please, Mr. Snowden, whatever it takes!
 
 
-8 # tonenotvolume 2013-06-11 14:06
[quote name="fractivis t"]"Though Snowden may look and act like Jesus" Huh? Don't get that. Are you quoting the media or do you really think that?
 
 
+51 # tomo 2013-06-11 13:01
Not sure what Midwest is saying. I certainly hope--but don't expect--that in discussing Snowden we will focus on the issues Snowden says motivated his disclosure. I know we live in a surveillance society--one in which our government increasingly feels it has a right to censor everything we say and do; one in which freedom of speech and the right to privacy (which the Bill of Rights attempted to protect by limiting the government's powers of search) are now regarded as expendable and quaint. Bush, Obama, and Yoo are united in thinking the government can do anything to protect our free society--includ ing abandon all freedom of the society they claim to protect. As I approach my 79th year, I am astounded and dismayed at the transformation our nation has undergone.
 
 
+19 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 14:21
Great comment.

The government has wanted to do these things for decades. The only thing that's really changed is that they now have the ability to get what they want. In the future, they'll have even more power to do even more nasty intrusive things to us. There's no limit to the technology. The only limit that can be put on it will be in the form of legal checks and balances that currently have been thrown out the window.
 
 
+8 # ghostperson 2013-06-11 20:32
Tomo: I'm a decade younger than you and I look back at protections the supreme court assured to individuals in the last quarter of the 20th century (1966 thru 1970s) and our devolution into an incipient police state the only function of which is to do the bidding of corporatists. I am stunned by magnitude of rights lost by the American people. I now see the goal of the assault on free public education and pricing higher education out of reach for all but the elite and privileged. We are on the edge of a Blade Runner-Minority Report Society. I'm glad I won't be alive to see the total conversion but I fear for my children and their children.
 
 
+3 # RLF 2013-06-12 06:06
The price of higher ed has been put in place by the right wing zealots that are on the boards of most of the universities. I don't know if it has been organized but it might have been. It's effect is to create wage slaves...too afraid to organize or protest because they might lose their jobs. It worked.
 
 
+3 # ghostperson 2013-06-12 14:24
RLF: It is organized. It is called the "corporate education agenda." The goal is to structure a system like Europe that weeds out those that don't matter through tests that state legislators can't pass. Socio-economics play a big role in ability to pass tests. The questions are tortuous. I couldn't answer some of the questions trying to help my daughter and I have 3 degrees two of them advanced. The CEA system creates 3 levels: an underclass for which contempt is shown, those educated just enough to work menial, low-pay jobs (neither class is a threat to elites) and those who will receive higher education (a very small group). Last year, it was reported that only 30-33% of Americans have college education. By contrast, good, well-paying jobs require high education and advanced technical skills. Our current system is inverse. We are killing education when it has never been needed more. Saturn is eating his young. Major educational publishers say that their business model tracks corporate America's overarching business plan. Constantly revising tests is a boon to the educational publishing industry which publishes guides, workbooks, test study aids. We are educating people to pass tests not for knowledge which I consider the equivalent of functional illiteracy. We are the object of derision internationally for our stance on education.
 
 
+13 # Carol R 2013-06-11 13:15
"Any analyst at any time can target anyone … I, sitting at my desk, certainly have the authorities to wiretap anyone - from you or your accountant, to a federal judge, to even the President."

This is having Snowden live a Bourne Supremacy chase. How sad that our government is sneaky. Oh my!! Am I being followed for my unpatriotic remarks?

Does the NSA want to repeat the comments that I made about Bush W. when I was working overseas and emailing friends in the US.?
 
 
+13 # NanFan 2013-06-11 14:38
Quoting Carol R:
Does the NSA want to repeat the comments that I made about Bush W. when I was working overseas and emailing friends in the US.?


Yes.
 
 
+17 # DaveM 2013-06-11 13:31
The Constitution of the United States guarantees the right of the people of the United States to mind their own business. Clearly this activity has been conducted outside the law, and as far as can be seen, to no good end.

Remember that the excuse for this horror is to "provide security", to "catch terrorists". If it is working, why does the FBI have to essentially create "terrorists" in order to find them? Why do the authorities work overtime to prosecute people whose only crime has been to do a Google search for a map of a military facility or some such?

"There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. And then you cash in on guilt" --Ayn Rand.
 
 
-42 # jack406 2013-06-11 13:38
Snowden is a criminal. He is a spy. He leaked critical National Intelligence.
Unless he goes to Russia or China, he will go to jail!
 
 
+14 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 16:59
It's "critical national intelligence" that ordinary law abiding American citizens are being spied on just as much as terrorists? Explain.

It's "critical national intelligence" that disgruntled ex-boyfriends who work with the N.S.A. now have the authority to harass their ex-girlfriends with a government stamp of approval? Explain.

It's "critical national intelligence" that a low-level employee of the N.S.A. (or the private contractors that work with them) could sell secrets THAT REALLY ARE critical to the Chinese government for a few million dollars? Explain...

It's "critical national intelligence" that low-level 20-somethings working for a private contractor can now spy on the President of the United States? Explain...

-----------------

Snowden's not guilty of "treason". He's guilty of embarrassing people who hate every principle this country was founded on.
 
 
+6 # RLF 2013-06-12 06:09
All you have to say next is "I'm not hiding anything, I don't care if they listen" to show how thoughtless you are. Just because you are not in a position to need the protections of the constitution doesn't mean other people should give up those protections for you sense of security. Start using that, so far, useless thing between your ears!
 
 
+1 # hammermann 2013-06-13 06:25
Actually, poor Ed probably has no public future anywhere. China is more obsessed with crushing their own dissidents than sticking a finger in America's eye, so they will turn him over just to generate "good will", and promote future quid pro quo's. Russia may be his only hope, but they would extract his secrets in exchange- this guy is still a patriot, I think.

On the other hand, he's NSA/CIA and he must have prepared for this with some almost foolproof other identities- he has a soft young face that could adopt great disguises. I hope he disappears cause it seems impossible that the gov won't crush him. Or maybe he means to be a martyr.
 
 
+15 # jwb110 2013-06-11 14:02
When the rest of the world gets up in arms about the privacy and security of their countries things will change. The issue will become the US domination of all peoples rights worldwide. They are asking the question "Who is the real enemy and why are we being treated as though WE are." The rest of the world can ask these questions and not be shouted down by the Fox News Crowd or the Koch Bros., or the military. The transparency we would like here they will get in Europe, Africa, China, etc. They may not like being looked at oever the shoulder or losing rights by default to the Only Super Power. I would bet they would be more willing to look at Congress and their duplicity in this.
This house of cards we call the Patriot Act and FEMA and Citizens United, will be hit by a bigger wind than they expect.
 
 
+3 # NanFan 2013-06-12 10:18
Quoting jwb110:
I would bet they would be more willing to look at Congress and their duplicity in this.


Yes, this is the real house of cards that needs to fall, and it is really the entire US government's responsibility, as Congress authorized these things, put them into law, even before the Obama administration.

Many of us have said for a long, long time that if the US government does not hold accountable those who commit illegal actions that serve to harm the World community, not just the US, that the World court will...hopefull y. Obama had the opportunity to investigate, to rise above, to veto, to end it...but he didn't.

N.
 
 
+7 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 14:15
"Truth starts out as heresy, grows into fasion, and decays as superstition"

-old Zen saying
 
 
-3 # futhark 2013-06-11 14:22
Edward Snowden Is A Ron Paul Supporter.

He donated $250 to Rep. Ron Paul's 2012 presidential campaign, recognizing Ron Paul was the most consistent opponent of government infringing our liberty and of the executive branch violating the Constitution.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/10/edward-snowden-ron-paul_n_3414992.html

In turn, Ron Paul has had kind words for Mr. Snowden, as he has called Bradley Manning a patriot and a hero. How does that set with many of you former Obama worshipers?
 
 
+13 # NanFan 2013-06-11 14:42
Quoting futhark:
How does that set with many of you former Obama worshipers?


Not well, believe me. Many of us have lost faith a long time ago, when Gitmo was not closed as promised, when GW was not investigated, when Mr. Obama signed the NDAA, when we learned that drones were being flown all over the US, and so much more.

It's a hard biscuit to swallow, but it's real, though it sure does hurt going down.

N.
 
 
+15 # reiverpacific 2013-06-11 14:49
Quoting futhark:
Edward Snowden Is A Ron Paul Supporter.

He donated $250 to Rep. Ron Paul's 2012 presidential campaign, recognizing Ron Paul was the most consistent opponent of government infringing our liberty and of the executive branch violating the Constitution.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/06/10/edward-snowden-ron-paul_n_3414992.html

In turn, Ron Paul has had kind words for Mr. Snowden, as he has called Bradley Manning a patriot and a hero. How does that set with many of you former Obama worshipers?


Actually, it's completely consistent with Ron Paul's Libertarian platform. Like progresssives, he claims to believe in freedom of speech, action and creative and question thought plus is anti-war. You might not like much of what he says or does but progressives need a political ally on essentials like war, peace, secrets, targeting innocents, rendition, imprisonment without due process and wire-tapping for a start.
I'm a "small-business Socialist" but have been able to find common ground with several Libertarians where I live, mostly along the lines of the foregoing list.
Open minds shall openings find.
The Rethugs are too far gone to the right of Mussolini and the Dems are becoming more bluey-and-doggy every day, with a few notable and courageous exceptions, as Obama marches more in goose-step, "Yes massah:" with the true rulers of the US lumbering empire, the military-indust rial-corporate monopolies and their patsy media.
 
 
+12 # paula schramm 2013-06-11 16:03
Libertarians and progressives have a lot in common.... and issues of infringement of liberty and the executive branch violating the Constitution are right up there at the top of the list !

So, to answer # futhark's question, ( I've actually never been an Obama "worshiper" but I maybe know what he's getting at) , it sets just fine with me , and we should all work together whenever we can, people !
 
 
+11 # Billy Bob 2013-06-11 17:01
As someone who doesn't "worship" human beings (not even St. Paul), I'd say it would sit a whole hell of a lot better with me, if Paul wasn't for destroying the entire social safety net, and turning the entire federal government over to his cronies for personal private profit at public expense.
 
 
+4 # reiverpacific 2013-06-12 10:50
Quoting Billy Bob:
As someone who doesn't "worship" human beings (not even St. Paul), I'd say it would sit a whole hell of a lot better with me, if Paul wasn't for destroying the entire social safety net, and turning the entire federal government over to his cronies for personal private profit at public expense.

Absolutely!
As I wrote, you don't have to like everything he does and yet progressives have so few allies in the increasingly medievalist country, it seems to me to be politic to find allies for even a few issues where they can be found and let' face it, if war, invasion and interference with other nations, usually the wrong ones to start with, there might be enough of the budget left to strengthen what little safety net is remains.
And we can oppose them on that issue.
The Rethuglies have used the Tea Buggers rather too effectively in this respect.
I have quite a few Libertarian acquaintances where I live and it's quite gratifying to find some common ground -and be able to have a decent debate on our differences (and occasionally get a grudging acquiescence). Reactionaries on the other hand, are utterly blinkered and unreachable with even the most obvious and clear reasoning in my experience and are waste of time debating (they invariably become personal, clichéd and abusive); just look at the ones who infest RSN at times.
 
 
+14 # Vardoz 2013-06-11 14:38
It is dangerous for any govt to have this degree of power. It is a threat to our rights and freedoms. This combined with no right to due process makes this level of intrusion even more unacceptable. This is very importnt information that we have known for a long time but I did not know how many people were granted the right to all my personal info. Over a million? But rather then take care of our people and economy, they paid Banks and Wall St trillions for outright fraud and no one went to jail for bringing down nations. If this isn't a gigantic threat, an economic destroyer, I don't know what is. This spy empire is spending untold billions to gather info that have nothing to do with any real danger. And while the Elite have their way, we are held accountable. Our govt has opened a Pandoras box and now all other nations will work to hack into our govts secrets since theytoo are also being violated.China already has access to our senators and congresses computers as Rachael Maddow pointed out on MSNBC.
 
 
+13 # Starheart 2013-06-11 14:45
The gathering of data by government and their contractors is nothing compared to the criminal operations that they are engaging in on politically outspoken targeted individuals and activists. I have been repeatedly burglarized by people involved in surveillance, searches and burglaries now.... & the local law enforcement is involved in protected these people because they are connected to Homeland Securitys' Political Repression Task Force
 
 
+6 # NanFan 2013-06-11 15:01
World Leaders Worried about US Surveillance

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22857062

N.
 
 
+1 # reiverpacific 2013-06-12 10:50
Quoting NanFan:
World Leaders Worried about US Surveillance

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-22857062

N.

You beat me to the post on this one; thanks.
 
 
+12 # Norma 2013-06-11 16:17
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/pardon-edward-snowden/Dp03vGYD

A Petition to pardon Mr.Snowden. Went from 22,000 yesterday to 54,000 today!
 
 
+1 # NanFan 2013-06-14 15:08
Quoting Norma:
https://petitions.whitehouse.gov/petition/pardon-edward-snowden/Dp03vGYD

A Petition to pardon Mr.Snowden. Went from 22,000 yesterday to 54,000 today!


It's actually now up to about 79,000 -- June 14.

N.
 
 
+9 # lobdillj 2013-06-11 18:11
I think it is critical to the future of our nation that we, the people, speak our minds on this and demand to be heard and obeyed.

We are on a slippery slope, sliding ever more rapidly into becoming a fascistic surveillance state. The revelation brought by Edward Snowden is alarming and consistent with all other clues as to what is happening to us. History teaches us that this kind of national trajectory never has a gentle beneficial end point. It also has become painfully apparent that our founding forefathers were unaware of psychopathy and how to protect the nation from this now known threat to freedom. Because the Constitution has an Achilles Heel with respect to psychopathy we are now experiencing what can, and likely will, become our doom as a nation if we do not act forcefully.

Do we really need more secrecy than we did during World War II or the Cold War? Is it really necessary to keep the citizens in the dark and feed them bullshit like a mushroom farm?

We need to demand an end to this insanity and strip the psychopaths of their power. NOW!!!
 
 
+10 # Texas Aggie 2013-06-11 22:13
So far I haven't heard anything comparing what Mr. Snowden and Daniel Ellsberg did. To me the two events are almost identical, exposing "secret" information that the government wants hidden because it reflects very poorly on them. At one point the NYT had the decency to print the Pentagon Papers, but now it takes a British paper to do what our craven press is too afraid to do.
 
 
+7 # WBoardman 2013-06-12 09:44
The comparison is out there, if not widespread.
Ellsberg himself made it, saying that what
Snowden did was more important.

The Pentagon Papers themselves were complete,
while the war went on.

Everything about the NSA is open-ended and ongoing
and apparently out of control.

Has anyone asked the question:
how many fake terrorist FBI sting plots
did the NSA data sweep pick up?
 
 
+1 # bobjbax 2013-06-18 13:21
"I want people to see the truth, because without it you cannot make informed decisions as a public." - Private First Class Bradley Manning

"I don't want to live in a world where there's no privacy and therefore no room for intellectual exploration and creativity." - Edward Snowden

Seek the Truth. Live By It. Be Free

WAR.. or Peace

Only Truth Brings Peace

These two men could not have voiced it better. Says it for me.
 

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