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Pierce writes: "The New York Times had a story on Friday that should’ve brought shame and derision upon anyone who voted for the racist monster in the White House, and upon the racist monster that the other racist monster installed at the head of the Department of Justice."

Supporters of Donald Trump. (photo: Getty Images)
Supporters of Donald Trump. (photo: Getty Images)


I Don't Need to 'Understand' Anyone Who Still Supports This President

By Charles Pierce, Esquire

10 June 18


What his administration* is doing to these migrant children is a national disgrace.

he New York Times had a story on Friday that should’ve brought shame and derision upon anyone who voted for the racist monster in the White House, and upon the racist monster that the other racist monster installed at the head of the Department of Justice. The United States government is now committing human rights atrocities within its own borders and against the most vulnerable people it can find. I don’t need to “understand,” much less take seriously, anyone who still supports this president* and his administration* because, if you do, you’ve taken the idea of America and run battery acid through its veins.

An American government escort handed over the 5-year-old child, identified on his travel documents as José, to the American woman whose family was entrusted with caring for him. He refused to take her hand. He did not cry. He was silent on the ride “home.” The first few nights, he cried himself to sleep. Then it turned into “just moaning and moaning,” said Janice, his foster mother. He recently slept through the night for the first time, though he still insists on tucking the family pictures under his pillow.

José’s separation from his father is part of the Trump administration’s latest and most widely debated border enforcement policy. Last month, Attorney General Jeff Sessions announced that the government would criminally prosecute everyone who crosses the border illegally, a directive that is already leading to the breakup of hundreds of migrant families and channeling children into shelters and foster homes across the country.

Does it get worse? Trick question.

Among other children recently fostered by Bethany families is an 18-month-old girl separated from her father, who has been detained. The child cries frequently, especially when she changes settings, such as leaving her foster family’s home to attend a doctor’s appointment.

Dona Abbott, Bethany’s refugee program director, said that these newly separated children frequently have nightmares, anxiety and stomachaches. A 3-year-old boy taken from his mother at the border was inconsolable during his flight to Michigan and cried incessantly on arrival at his new home last month, she said. He recently has begun to bond with his foster mother, from whom he is now reluctant to be apart. “He seems fearful of losing yet another attachment,” Ms. Abbott said.

What in the hell are we doing calling ourselves civilized, let alone a free nation?

The one thing that animated him was discussing his “photos,” as he called the family drawings. He introduced “mi familia,” pointing to the figures of his parents, brother and younger sister. Staring intensely at the sketch of his father, with a slight mustache and a cap, he repeated his name out loud again and again. It was “just me and him” on the trip from Honduras, he told Janice one night as he lay in bed shuffling the pictures, taking turns looking at one and then the other.

“He holds onto the two pictures for dear life,” Janice said, through tears. “It’s heart-wrenching.”… When sirens pierced the quiet of the night last week, José’s eyes widened with fear. “La violencia, la violencia,” he said. The family assured him that it was not violence; it was fire trucks.

Fire trucks. Jesus. Janice, the foster mother in the story, is practically the only person in it with whom I’m happy to share a planet.

“It’s incredibly conflicting for me as a parent to watch this little boy begin to just have fun and experience joy in simple pleasures,” Janice said. “His dad doesn’t get to see him being joyful. It’s as if these moments with his son have been stolen from him. I am no substitute.”

For sure, the boy’s family always seems to be on his mind.

At bedtime one night last week, he announced: “I am going with my papa on Saturday.”

To which Janice responded, “You know, mi amor, I don’t think it will be Saturday. First we have to get more information about where your dad is so that we can call him, and then we’ll see.”

He listened, and then asked her to remain in the room. “I don’t want to be alone,” he said.

So, thanks to this president* and his 63 million enablers, and his acolytes in the media, and all the people who didn’t care enough to stop him in 2016, and all the people who don’t care enough to stop him now, we have our own American variations on the Tuam babies and the Magdalene Laundries.

Children are being punished, cruelly and mindlessly, for the perceived sins of their parents and, because we are a secular republic, it is not being done in the name of God but, rather, on the behalf of everybody in this country. That does not make this better. Not by a longshot.


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+61 # BetaTheta 2018-06-10 10:19
And, as imprisonment and hearings for the parents drag on, many of these children will form new attachments that will in turn have to be torn asunder. Trump, Sessions, et al belong before an international tribunal to answer for their crimes.
 
 
+41 # pop65 2018-06-10 10:27
Swelling the ranks of children with developmental trauma.
 
 
-1 # librarian1984 2018-06-10 10:27
Inhumane policies being implemented were put in place, and used, by previous administrations , so I have to applaud Trump for motivating reporters like Pierce to FINALLY report on the abominable things that have been going on for years.

Deporter-in-Chief Obama ejected more people than any US president. W and his D!ck started two illegal wars. Obama turned it into EIGHT, ordered a TRILLION $ nuke makeover and built two massive drone bases in Africa. Nice of the press to suddenly take an interest.

I suspect if Hillary'd won, and was doing the exact same things, we wouldn't hear a word about it. Pierce et al wouldn't be screeching about the outrages day after day. No, it would be a-okay.

I'll agree we have to rely on the press to check government power, and that frightens me as much as Trump, because long after he's gone we'll still be stuck with this dishonest, propagandizing corporate press -- a corporate press, like the DEMOCRAT Party, that doesn't think we need to analyse or understand the political movements afoot, but tells us to embrace ignorance and intolerance as virtues.

MILLIONS of Obama voters stayed home or voted for Trump. It is ESSENTIAL to know why that happened. But by all means, 'Journalist' Pierce, let's eschew analysis for snarky headlines and the glorification of ignorance -- and then tell ourselves that we're better than 'them'.

Great plan which, I'll note, Pierce has advocated multiple times since day one.
 
 
+3 # kyzipster 2018-06-11 12:15
Not only are 'we' better than them on the immigration issue, I'd say that Bush and McCain are better than them because of their support for amnesty.

Obama as 'deporter in chief' is a simplistic take on this issue. He focused on illegal immigrants who had committed crimes and real time border crossings.

I would agree that the media ignored this issue during the Obama years and that they're sensational as heck, doing all they can to paint Trump as a monster, but I don't support the idea that numbers of deportations equate to the same ideology or injustices.

Obama, like McCain, Bush and most Democrats, supported legislation that would give legal status to millions of people already living and working here. Any effort on Obama's part to get the debate going again was ignored in the media.

In some cases, they've been here for decades. The Nativism of Trump's base believes in indiscriminate deportations. People are in hiding right now, too afraid to go to work or take their kids to school. This is the difference between Obama and Trump's America.

I wish the media had focused on Obama, and not in a flattering way necessarily. It might have helped to dispel this myth that Democrats want open borders and want to do nothing about illegal immigration. What many people want is a humane solution to the over 10 million people who are already here. People we basically invited here with lax labor laws, the IRS, etc.

This is one of the top reasons I voted against Trump.
 
 
+57 # soularddave 2018-06-10 10:36
This is not the country or civilization I was raised to be a part of. This is NOT the "freedoms" I was drafted into the Army to defend. This is not the political climate I voted for.

What happened to my USA?
 
 
+33 # pmargaret7 2018-06-10 10:38
Truly heartbreaking! What to do? I'm calling my congressman and senators, as should everyone, but the whole "republic" is sinking too fast to tread water! Sickening!
 
 
+23 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-10 10:51
"The United States government is now committing human rights atrocities within its own borders and against the most vulnerable people it can find."


Gee! Is this news? I'd say the US has been committing atrocities within its own borders for its whole existence.

Does Pierce not know about the Indian Education Act passed in the late 19th century. It kidnapped children of Native Americans and moved them into "re-education camps" on the east coast so they could be raised "white" and forget their native culture. The largest such school was at Carlisle, PA. It was not closed until the 1970s. It was devastating to kids. Its goal was to eliminate Native Americans by eliminating their culture and language through children.

The former Indian School at Carlisle, PA, is now the US Army War College! Shows how the US government thinks.


"thanks to this president* and his 63 million enablers, and his acolytes in the media, and all the people who didn’t care enough to stop him in 2016"

And thanks to the people who voted for Obama and got the same thing. Look at this report:

"U.S. Deports 46K Parents With Citizen Kids in Just Six Months

Data obtained through a Freedom of Information Act request reveals nearly a quarter of people deported in first half of 2011 were parents with U.S. citizen children. That's a dramatic increase from the 10-year period."

https://www.colorlines.com/articles/us-deports-46k-parents-citizen-kids-just-six-months
 
 
+12 # NAVYVET 2018-06-10 16:18
Thanks, Rodion. And there were man thousands of slave families broken asunder because it was more profitable to their "owner".
 
 
+5 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-11 11:04
Yes, indeed, selling family members "down river" was a horrible experience for slave parents. I've read dozens of memoirs and novels written by slaves and the breaking op of families at slave auctions was always the worst experience.

I visited the Indian School at Carlisle in the early 1980s with a friend who was a historian at Penn State. His dissertation was on Indian schools. He'd been there many times. When we were there it was just abandoned property and very run down. But I was amazed at what a huge and opulently built campus it was. Probably several thousand acres -- Indian children were trained in farming, mechanic work, as well as academic subjects. There were probably 50 buildings.

We found boxes of old records. We took them. He probably still has them. I did not look closely at them back then. Now I wish I had.

All colonialist powers know that the most effective way to destroy people is to destroy their families. The US has been using this tactic from its beginning up to right now. But now, it is getting exposed because of the crudeness of Trump and his henchmen like Sessions. The much smoother Obama did not ruffle any feathers.
 
 
+39 # ahollman 2018-06-10 10:58
Perhaps it's time to call the FBI, report multiple cases of kidnapping by Donald Trump and Jeff Sessions, and ask them to investigate.

Republicans, and more generally those who support Trump, now have zero credibility when they claim they are "pro-family"

Under US law, those who cross the border and present themselves to immigration agents saying they are fleeing persecution have a right to a hearing to make their case. Having helped refugees, I can say that not all have a good case, that not all are angels, and that not all should be allowed to stay in the US. Nevertheless, they still have a right to have their cases heard.

It is difficult to make a case. Those who arrive often come lacking documents either identifying them or supporting their claim. Currently, they do not have a legal right to a lawyer when presenting their case. Imagine the difficulty of participating in a legal hearing when you are unfamiliar with a complex legal system and may not speak English fluently.

Many (not all) fled due to potential violence directed against their children. Courtesy of Trump and Sessions, they have now lost custody of their children, and parents and children have no idea where each other are, nor when they will next be in touch.

Let's be honest. This kidnapping does not stem from any laws or rules dictating where or how detainees should be housed, or which agency should take responsibility for their custody. It is spite and meanness, pure and simple.
 
 
+13 # Texas Aggie 2018-06-10 22:12
"Under US law, those who cross the border and present themselves to immigration agents saying they are fleeing persecution have a right to a hearing to make their case. Having helped refugees, I can say that not all have a good case, that not all are angels, and that not all should be allowed to stay in the US. Nevertheless, they still have a right to have their cases heard."

This! Sessions and Nielsen are both aware that being a refugee is NOT illegal and that the US is bound by international law to uphold the right of anyone claiming asylum to make their case. Until that case is decided, they are most definitely NOT illegally here, and to take away their kids is pure evil and illegal as hell. The viciousness of these two evildoers is just infuriating.
 
 
+7 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-10 11:09
I DO need to a journalist like Pierce. This same thing was going on during the Obama term, but apparently Pierce did not notice. There were reports and articles/books from the activist community. It seems as if Esquire is not interested in research produced by the activist community, but when the NYTimes publishes something, Esquire is all over it.

On another thread I linked to this report from 2011 --


“Shattered Families: The Perilous Intersection of Immigration Enforcement and the Child Welfare System,”

http://act.colorlines.com/acton/attachment/1069/f-0079/0/-/-/-/-/ARC_Report_Shattered_Families_FULL_REPORT_Nov2011Release.pdf

The report is filled with heart-rending stories just like above:

"Josefina’s baby was just 9-months old and Clara’s children were 1 and
6 when they were placed in foster homes with strangers. Clara and
Josefina, sisters in their early 30s who lived together in a small New
Mexico town, had done nothing to harm their children or to elicit the
attention of the child welfare department.

In the late summer of 2010, a team of federal immigration agents arrived at the front door of Clara and Josefina’s trailer home in New Mexico. Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE ) had received a false tip that the sisters, who were undocumented immigrants, had
drugs in their home. Though they found nothing . . . ICE called Child Protective Services (CPS ) to take custody of the children.


continued below --
 
 
+6 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-10 11:15
Pierce would have us think that all this began under Trump. The problem with that is not only that it is false, but when Trump is gone in 2020, the same criminal inhumanity will continue but the media and the US population will go right back to sleep as they were under Obama.

Here are the key findings of this report:


As of 2011, at least 5,100 children currently living in foster care who are prevented from uniting with their detained or deported parents.

If nothing changes, 15,000 more children may face a similar fate in the next 5 years.

Families are more likely to be separated where local police aggressively participate in immigration enforcement.

Immigrant victims of domestic violence are at particular risk of losing their children.

ICE detention obstructs participation in Child Protective Services’ plans for family unity.

Most child welfare departments lack systemic policies to keep families united when parents are detained or deported.



Some months ago, Putin was asked if in 2016 he preferred Trump to Hillary. He laughed and said, "of course not. US presidents come and go but the policies remain the same. We have to deal with those policies" (my paraphrase).

I can't understand journalists like Pierce who think that the personality in the White House matters more than just a little. The immigration policies under Bush, Obama, Trump are all the same. The policy is broken. We need to fix it. Forget Trump.
 
 
+2 # kyzipster 2018-06-11 13:38
The difference as I see it is that ICE was responding to a vigilante accusing an illegal of dealing drugs, within the rules of ICE, they were required to arrest them for being here illegally once they confronted them. ICE is motivated much more under Trump to go after people for just the crime of being here illegally. Under Obama it was a focus on illegals who committed crimes. Many innocent people were also swept up in the system but the atmosphere for illegal workers was not nearly as intense as it is right now. This opinion of mine comes from an illegal friend who can no longer work and is basically in hiding right now. I can't say to what extent his fear is reality based or how much he's been influenced by anti-Trump propaganda. There has always been a risk of getting a DUI or some other offense and getting tagged by ICE for deportation. Now, it may very well be true that just looking like an illegal puts a person at risk. That's a huge difference imo, and it puts legal citizens at much more risk of racist BS coming their way.

I read stories through the Obama years of injustices in the deportation process. Detainment facilities overflowing, people stuck in limbo for months on end, waiting for a hearing. You're right that the press did not give it nearly enough attention and the Dem base tends to ignore it when their person is in power.

I part ways in trying to make the case that both sides are exactly the same. There is a lot of evidence that says otherwise.
 
 
0 # kyzipster 2018-06-11 13:49
..I think the distinction is critical. It's not about defending the Democratic Party. For me, it's also defending the Republican Party of the recent past. Before this Tea Party/Nativist sentiment became so pervasive. The very thing that helped put Trump in the White House.

As you said, we need to fix it. Progressives and sane conservatives need to decide what they want on this issue and urge the next presidential candidate to speak to it.

I don't want open borders and no enforcement of immigration laws, I think I'm with a majority but progressives don't want to talk about it much. The unflattering details of keeping enforcement in place. I think immigrants add a great deal to this society and I feel much empathy for the 10+ million who are already here but I don't believe open borders can work.

Bush and McCain and many other establishment Republicans supported amnesty of millions who are already here. Bush got elected with 40% of the Hispanic vote by promising it, Trump only got 30%, soon to be the largest minority in the country if it isn't already. It's one of the only issues I supported him on. We need to get back to this discussion. Obama tried repeatedly and was mostly ignored by the press, as was the Republican obstruction.
 
 
+3 # tedrey 2018-06-10 11:19
Matthew 25:43, 46
 
 
+7 # Dfnclblty 2018-06-10 11:23
criminal beyond belief;
potus & ag are amoral and psychopathique;

Thankyou for reporting and exposing this genocide
 
 
+16 # Michaeljohn 2018-06-10 11:26
Trump is playing the same 'little Marco' and 'Lyin Ted' game with our former G7 allies as he did in the primaries. Gives the term 'Ugly American' a whole new meaning.
 
 
-16 # RMF 2018-06-10 11:31
Pierce chronicles a very sad tale, one composed of brutality against children, the very epitome of the defenseless, and one that can only be called for what it is, an atrocity.

But, as Librarian, Rodian, and many others here continue to recite, it's not TOO HIGH A PRICE to pay in keeping Hillary and the Dems out of the White House or fairly represented on the Supreme Court. Yes, yes, yes they say -- to hear them tell it we should still be thankful we don't have Hillary and the Dems in the White House, or in position to place a progressive nominee on the Supreme Court.

So, given this context, I have to ask, and it's not simply rhetorical, who exactly are Librarian, Rodian, and the other Hillary/Dem haters here really working for?
 
 
+9 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-10 20:05
RMF - you misread my points. Had Hillary been elected, these policies would have continued without the slightest protest from the mass media or democrats, who all would have been sound asleep as they were under Obama. Because Trump is president, they are getting woke. They are protesting really atrocious and criminal policies because Trump is a lightening rod.

For me, Hillary and Trump were about the same. I voted for Jill Stein because the platform of the Green Party was something I really did believe in. The platforms of the Repubs and DEmos were just bullshit and bad. BUT -- Hillary would have put demos to sleep and there would have been no reform in the demo party. Trump is waking demos up and provoking a lot of protest and resistance. So probably Trump is better in the long run. I doubt that you are smart enough to see the logic in this but here is an example of how it works.

Today Feinstein introduced a bill in the senate to prohibit family separation. This is how it works. Because Trump is the boogieman, Feinstein got to work and wrote this bill. Had Hillary been president, Feinstein would never have done this. I heard her interviewed today and the interviewer asked "did you not know this happened under Obama" and she said "no, I did not know it." Why not? Because she and the mass media were sound asleep.

So we are getting better action from demos because Trump won.
 
 
-2 # RMF 2018-06-13 13:29
If you are truthful about voting for Stein then you helped elect Trump -- just as those voting for Nader in 2000 helped to elect W.

And, contrary to your and Librarian's constant bleating, it's demonstrably clear that in terms of policy the Dems are much preferable to the reactionary (now fascist) GOP.

Thus a reasonable mind (apparently in short supply here on RSN) must strongly suspect the presence of a hidden motive animating the constant Dem bashing message of apparent provocateurs here on RSN.

If the above doesn't satisfy to persuade about the preference for Dem policy then consider just these few actions of the GOP under Trump:

> US Default on Paris Climate Accord
> US default on Iran nuclear treaty
> Gorsuch on Sup Ct cementing GOP majority
> Adoption of regressive tax bill
> Continuing Obamacare repeal effort
> Tariff plan to increase corp profit at cost of labor

If that's not good enough for you, then consider these offenses committed by the GOP/Trump administration now pending adjudication:

> Obstruction of Justice
> Conspiracy against the US (Russia Collusion)
> Violation of Campaign Finance Law
> Violation of Emoluments Clause
> Money laundering and RICO
> Foreign Corrupt Practices Act -- Bribery and Fraud
> Witness Intimidation/Tampering
> Malfeasance in Office (NFL etc)
> Misprision of a Felony (not reported to FBI)
> Lying to Special Counsel, FBI, and Congress
 
 
0 # Benign Observer 2018-06-16 14:33
What bull. Why are you here on a progressive site constantly telling people to buy the Democratic Party's crap?

No matter what they do, no matter how corrupt they prove to be, your only solution is blind obedience and loyalty -- even when they're not loyal to us. You're pathetic. Why don't you peddle this nonsense at Daily Kos? They'd love you there.

And still trotting out the nonsense about Nader? More Floridian Democrats voted for W than voted for Nader. Just shows what a dishonest agent you are.

Wait til the primaries start -- we'll see who has credibility with the voters. Hillbots like you are loud and obnoxious but you're in the minority -- with good reason. People are fed up with lies and corruption. Apparently you're quite keen on it. Is that where you get your paycheck?
 
 
+6 # librarian1984 2018-06-11 01:40
Did progressives advise Hillary not to go to WI? Did Putin tell her to pick a VP to her right? Read Shattered, where her own people discuss her MANY problems and mistakes -- but the only people you ever blame are the ones who BEGGED the party for honest elections and a populist message -- which they still refuse.

Did any of us tell her to use an illegal email server and then ignore all the advisors who told her to deal with it back in 2015? SHE RAN WHILE UNDER FEDERAL INVESTIGATION! That's OUR fault?

You know Trump won by running TO HER LEFT, yeah? Suggesting the party should be moving TO THE LEFT. But they're doing the opposite, reinvigorating the blue dogs while Pelosi just said she supports pay-go -- meaning candidates won't be able to propose policies like infrastructure spending or improved healthcare in 2018.

You realize these leaders have lost a thousand seats, right? So why are you helping them avoid reform?

You, like eric, make the SAME arguments over and over, ignoring our responses, never changing your script, never blaming anyone but progressives (who you attack more than Trump).

There's a strong case to be made that YOU are the pretender, that YOU are here, on a progressive site, under false pretenses, harassing progressives like a good establishment operative, or maybe even a mole from the MIIC toxic slime.

Who's YOUR boss, RMF, and just what is YOUR game? What are YOUR motives -- and who are YOU working for?
 
 
+4 # vicnada 2018-06-11 21:49
I just put my Bernie sign back on my lawn but the 2016 is striped over with HINDSIGHT 2020. RMF, you still haven't learned the bitter lesson have you? It is superdelegates, a corrupt DNC and, yes, based on what we now know, Hillary herself that are directly responsible for the Trump presidency and all the wickedness that has followed in its wake. I hope you and your "democracy hating" cohorts get clear that rigging primaries kills the democratic process. And I hope you will stump as tirelessly for Bernie in 2020 as he did to get Hillary--yes, the one who betrayed him--elected in 2016.
 
 
+16 # James Klimaski 2018-06-10 11:47
At the behest of his handler Putin, President Bone Spur is trying to make the United States out to be the pariah of the world. That video Putin has must really be something.
 
 
+15 # futhark 2018-06-10 11:52
Bumper sticker: "Any Functioning Adult: 2020"

Advice for Mr. Trump from St. Paul in "the book that nobody beats", the Bible, 1 Corinthians 13:11 "When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things."

Empathy and compassion characterize adult thinking. Mr. Trump is going on 72 years old and still hasn't mastered social skills usually taught in kindergarten.
 
 
+1 # Rodion Raskolnikov 2018-06-11 13:41
furth -- "Bumper sticker: "Any Functioning Adult: 2020"


be careful what you wish for.
 
 
+2 # Robbee 2018-06-10 12:10
basket of deplorables?
 
 
+7 # chrisconno 2018-06-10 12:11
I am so ashamed to be an American right now. We are torturing children in for-profit warehouses. How ashamed will we be if we find out there are mass graves near those warehouses? How much more ashamed can we be? Everyday I get that answer.
 
 
0 # Robbee 2018-06-10 12:12
I Don't Need to 'Understand' Anyone Who Still Supports This President
By Charles Pierce

irredeemable?
 
 
+3 # evolver 2018-06-10 12:31
Thank you Charles! It is unbearable to witness the atrocities of these greedy tyrants. Absolutely unbearable. And I certainly include Jeff Sessions in that mix because he appears to enjoy it - he is as cold as ice! And yes, the supporters of these horrible people aren't much different - they identify with this activity because this is about a serious pathology. A pathology!
 
 
+8 # PeacefulGarden 2018-06-10 12:48
I agree fully with Charles. This is horrifying. I have called my congressman twice about this issue. I called about DACA. Sessions is dividing families as a means of punishment. Where on earth is the UN?

Republicans are heartless pigs who quote from the bible and brandish guns.
 
 
+3 # Jaax88 2018-06-10 13:52
It seems the administration is "all in because....? Because "we can, we have the power." This kind of attitude is anything goes, ethics, morals and laws be damned. That tag needs to be stuck all over
trump, not the great deal maker and not the big liar.
 
 
+5 # Blackjack 2018-06-10 14:26
AMEN! I don't want to understand people who are so wantonly ignorant and mean-spirited!
 
 
+4 # suzyskier 2018-06-10 15:12
I want to see these criminals at The Hague. No better than Hitler and Himmler! What a disgrace to our once great country! Where does all this spite and hate come from? Supposedly Christians, how?
 
 
0 # tomwalker8 2018-06-10 15:43
librarian1984 makes many solid points, but one deserves to be called out: "I suspect if Hillary'd won, and was doing the exact same things, we wouldn't hear a word about it. Pierce et al wouldn't be screeching about the outrages day after day. No, it would be a-okay."

You're kidding, right? Hillary gets some kind of pass in the press? Or she doesn't, but she would if she were POTUS? Yeah, right.
 
 
0 # librarian1984 2018-06-11 11:58
She mau not get a pass from Fox and Breitbart but she sure as hell does from MSDNC, CNN, NYT, WaPo et al. Watch Maddow interview her .. no hard questions. Once in a while they're critical but mostly the Clintons get a pass, especially on corruption and militarism. What did you hear about the uranium deal or the Clintons' and Podestas' substantial ties and dealings in Russia? What about her role in Libya and Honduras?

Didn't you hear journalists troubled by the advocacy their colleagues gave HRC after Trump secured his nomination? I heard several. Listen to Chris Hedges and Matt Taibbi on coverage, or read Thomas Frank's 'SWAT Team' on WaPo's coverage of Sanders -- which helped Hillary.

And we have proof the press would leave her alone, even on this page: criticizing Trump for programs Obama started or used even more.

How much coverage did Obama's drone wars in Africa get? How often did we hear he'd inherited two wars but turned it into EIGHT?

The press is not liberal, it's corporate, and they propagandize for the establishment, including gifted enablers like Obama and the Clintons.

I'm not saying there are never negative stories about Democrats, but do think it's disproportionat e and deliberately ineffectual.

When's the last time the msm bucked the status quo or went after the oligarchy? Do you think we know 5% of what the Kochs are doing? Why can't Hersh or Hedges get published in the US? Our press is really f'd up.
 
 
0 # librarian1984 2018-06-12 07:04
I answered you but for some reason it hasn't shown up.

Yes, I DO think the Clintons and aobama and others get a pass. Not 100% but not zero either. I listed many things that have been under- or unreported: wars, corruption, etc.
 
 
-2 # tomwalker8 2018-06-10 15:49
One other point regarding the Obama administration' s record number of deportations: that inflation was due primarily to a change in how "deportation" was defined. For more detail, read https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/obama-deported-more-people/
 
 
+7 # Wise woman 2018-06-10 17:56
This separation of children from their parents is nothing new in this country. First we did it to the slaves and then to the Native Americans. Our bad behavior predates trump by centuries. He's just the present example. There's "no better America" to go back to.
 
 
+2 # economagic 2018-06-11 08:00
I would argue that we ALL need to understand the people who still support this president*, because while they are not a majority, in our brave new digitally polarized world they are likely to be calling the shots for the foreseeable future if we don't devise a way to keep them in check.

As for the cruelty to individuals and families and the devastation of the planet they accept, endorse, or ignore, the is little new about it except the context. Robert Burns, who grew up in bitter poverty, spelled it out eloquently more than 200 years ago in "Man Was Made to Mourn," the poem in which the line, "Man's inhumanity to man" appears.

Regarding specifically this regime's cruelty to immigrants fleeing misery, its supporters would surely point out that the parents brought these troubles upon themselves and their children by entering the US illegally--and of course we must stop illegal immigration from destroying our country, the end justifying the means no matter how brutal.

And lest that view be seen as an aberration, an essay from "Slate" Magazine by Brian Palmer delves into the reasons people who have studied the matter believe that Evangelical Christians see care for the environment as none of their business, which may to some extent apply to their "laissez-faire" attitude toward "man's inhumanity to man" as well. They seem not only never to have read the New Testament, but to have failed to grasp the point of an altercation between brothers early in the Old.
 
 
+4 # librarian1984 2018-06-11 11:34
Art of War anyone? Of course we want to understand our adversary -- or a potential ally. To 'understand' is not to condone or even to sympathize.It is informed analysis in service to strategic planning.

It's not only morally wrong to perceive any group as monolithic, it's short-sighted and stupid.

You have a better chance of defeating an adversary if you understand them.

And one sleeps so much better if one hasn't spent the day as a hypocrite. We keep saying conservatives vote against their own self-interests and get duped by their party. WELL SO ARE WE!!

It is never rational to choose ignorance! NEVER.
 
 
+3 # economagic 2018-06-12 09:31
Right--ignoranc e may sometimes be bliss, but even then only in the short run.

Many people fail to grasp the idea that there are different KINDS of knowledge, and they are not all equivalent. The principle is captured in the old retort, "You wish in one hand and I'll spit in the other and we'll see which hand fills up first."

A group of literary critics who understood less than they thought they did made a grave mistake a few decades ago that led people even less well informed to believe that all knowledge IS equally reliable. The word "fact" is often abused and is hardly ever really well defined, and most of the results of scientific inquiry are approximations: The map is NEVER the territory. But incessant questioning of what we think we know, revising beliefs that are at odds with what else we think we know, generally leads to better and better approximations to notions we might call "facts."

This is especially the case in the "hard" or "quantitative" sciences, where we can measure the discrepancy between what we thought we knew and what we can actually observe and put a number to it. It applies almost as well in many other areas as well. But it is difficult to ask a "true believer" such as Scott Pruitt, whose entire education has been based on "Because So and So said so," "WHY do you think that is true?" enough times to get down to the contradictions and flimsy support for his positions.
 
 
+1 # MikeAF48 2018-06-11 16:37
Right before our very eyes, just like ALEC, the KOch bros., our rights, our independence our FREEDOM where have all the good jobs gone? incarceration. We Americans have a long list of issues, but I.ll never give up the drive.
 

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