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Intro: "The GOP governor tries to thwart Obama's decision allowing some undocumented kids to apply for work permits by issuing her own directive denying them driver licenses. Critics call her order mean-spirited and ill-advised political posturing."

Jan Brewer is fighting against Obama's DREAM Directive in Arizona. (photo: TPMMuckracker)
Jan Brewer is fighting against Obama's DREAM Directive in Arizona. (photo: TPMMuckracker)

Jan Brewer v. Barack Obama

By Terry Greene Sterling, The Daily Beast

17 August 12


The GOP governor tries to thwart Obama's decision allowing some undocumented kids to apply for work permits by issuing her own directive denying them driver licenses. Critics call her order mean-spirited and ill-advised political posturing.

ulleth Romero was 12 when she and her mother trekked through the oven-like Arizona desert. The two ran out of water and Zulleth's mother collapsed when she reached the highway, where a smuggler picked them up and transported them to Phoenix. Both survived and the girl, now 18, recently graduated with honors from a Phoenix-area high school.

On Wednesday, like many of the nation's 1.7 million young, undocumented immigrants known as "Dreamers" who were brought illegally to the United States as kids, a jubilant Romero began applying for a two-year renewable permit to work and stay in the United States temporarily, thanks to an administrative directive issued by President Obama in June. Zulleth says she celebrated because finally she could drive and work legally.

Then that same day, Arizona Gov. Jan Brewer, who had become a conservative superstar after wagging her finger at the president on an airport tarmac and subsequently calling Obama's Dreamer directive "back-door amnesty," fired back at Obama by issuing her own directive.

Governor Jan set off a heated national legal debate and scored points with her conservative fans by issuing an "executive order" denying Arizona's 80,000 Dreamers driver licenses and state identification cards, along with a handful of state benefits. That evening, Brewer said her order clarified that there would be no state-funded benefits and "no driver licenses for illegal people."

Federal law will prevent most Dreamers from accessing Medicaid or food stamps, and Arizona law bans them from enjoying a few state benefits, such as state-subsidized childcare, unemployment, and state contracts. Much of Brewer's administrative order was redundant, but seemed to set off yet another skirmish in the state's epic battle between old white people and young brown people.

But Brewer's driver-license prohibition could spell misery for Arizona Dreamers. In Phoenix, a sprawling city surrounded by a web of suburbs with limited public transportation, many have no choice but to drive to work.

While Democrats blasted Brewer for mean-spirited anti-Obama gasbagging with her executive order, the ACLU of Arizona and national immigration lawyers and activists scrambled to read Arizona's motor vehicle laws Thursday.

Their conclusion: Brewer doesn't understand the linkage between federal immigration law and Arizona's driver license statute. And that could open the Grand Canyon State to a slew of lawsuits.

Brewer, who once accused Obama of giving Dreamers amnesty, now seems to be signaling that Dreamers do not have amnesty. She argues that Dreamers may be getting a temporary reprieve from deportation under the Obama directive, but nevertheless will not be legally present in the United States-and thus can't legally drive in Arizona.

Immigration lawyers counter that the president's directive will indeed make Dreamers legally present in the country-which entitles them to Arizona driver licenses.

The legal debate over the driver licenses centers on the arcane immigration-law concept of being lawfully present vs. having lawful status.

Arizona law requires driver licenses be issued to those lawfully present under federal immigration law. Thanks to the Obama directive, Dreamers soon will be lawfully present. The state's driver-license law doesn't require lawful status, which Dreamers will not get under the Obama directive.

But Brewer "uses presence and status interchangeably," says Alessandra Soler, executive director of the ACLU of Arizona.

"Whoever reviewed this governor's executive order didn't understand immigration law," Soler told The Daily Beast. "The governor's order is based on bad advice...This is similar to problems we've seen with SB 1070 [Arizona's immigration law, signed by Brewer]-another example of her getting involved in federal immigration matters she has no business doing."

And Danny Ortega, a prominent Phoenix lawyer and former chair of the National Council of La Raza, said that for now he's reserving an opinion on which side will win, but described Brewer's move as pure political posturing.

Brewer's spokesman, Matthew Benson, said the governor is neither posturing politically posturer nor receiving bad legal advice. The governor's take is that even with Obama's directive, Dreamers won't be legally present in Arizona-and thus state law prohibits them from driving, he said in an interview.

Dreamers "have neither legal status nor legal presence....The governor is merely upholding Arizona law, as is her duty," he added in an email.

Others disagree.

"As a matter of federal immigration law, the governor's office is simply wrong," said Ben Winograd, staff attorney for the American Immigration Council in Washington. Dreamers, he says, "are considered to be lawfully present despite lacking valid immigration status."

The upshot: Despite the governor's executive order, Dreamers probably will be able to drive to work legally, although they might have to take Brewer to court.

If nothing else, the governor's executive order dampened the spirits of many Arizona Dreamers. Zulleth Romero and several other undocumented youths spent the night on the lawn of the Arizona Capitol, protesting Brewer's order. Thursday morning, Zulleth and other Dreamers visited Brewer's office in hopes of meeting with her. But Zulleth said "we were told she wasn't available." your social media marketing partner


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We too were alarmed at the patterns we were, and still are, seeing. It is clear that the provocateurs are far more savvy, disciplined, and purposeful than anything we have ever experienced before.

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+126 # Barbara K 2012-08-17 11:22
Maybe that Seven Miles of Bad Road needs to spend some time in her own jail, so she can learn that she isn't above the law. What a hateful witch she is. She is putting horrible laws in place to cover her butt.


DO VOTE as if your livelihood depends on it, as it certainly does.
+85 # Virginia 2012-08-17 12:28
Have you ever noticed that Republican women have that stiff frown line that looks like a smile would break their face - and that the really wrinkled ones look like they smoked for too many years trying to be part of the men's club or spent too much time at the pool? There is a certain dead stare both Repug men and women have - it's actually like their bodies have been invaded by aliens... Scary.

I guess they have to deliver that dead pan stare when they deliver their hyprocrisies or everyone would just think it was a joke.
-81 # JackB 2012-08-17 12:57
Not raving beauties like Hilary Clinton.
-29 # phrixus 2012-08-17 16:41
Somewhat less than "hot." Agreed.
+42 # WestWinds 2012-08-17 13:44
The light of love and trust has been beaten out of them somewhere along the line and their internal compass doesn't work to tell them "this is wrong; don't do it". They are angry people who haven't gotten enough fundamental love nurturing and hate the world for it. This is their excuse to "get even". Then they cram themselves full of material goods hoping this will fill the black hole inside. It may, for a while, but then like any addict or high risk gambler, they have to go back and do it again to get back that feeling of self-importance that was denied to them as children.

They really are zombies and I might have some pity for them, but it's like trying to muster pity and love for Jeffery Dahmer.
0 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:10
I would more than likely give some sympathy to likes of daumers than the damned
+20 # vitobonespur 2012-08-18 00:52
WestWinds, you're thinking too much. The bottom line is that Brewer, and others of her ilk, regardless of the reasons, are evil, nasty harpies who are lacking in compassion.
+1 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:28
I'm a nasty harpie but it's in self defense. There needs to be a distinction of mitigating circumstances.

I live in Florida and the people of the south think nothing of coming over, breaking into your house repeatedly, stealing anything they think you love or value (like wedding pictures, nursing licenses, college degrees, college ring, your clothes, your grandfather's tea cup and saucer,) and then going up on your new roof and punching five major holes in it. This is the type of people the Right want to dominate the world.
+2 # Phlippinout 2012-08-19 17:56
Yes westwinds, burglars of every race steal many personal things. Who are you referring to when you say "people from the south"? The thieves from the North and east and west are pretty bad too! I sure hope you are not referring to Florida white people or Crackers as they are called, they are the southerners there. Those folks might take offense to your negative stereotype of southern whites.
+22 # vitobonespur 2012-08-18 01:05
Here in California I used to work with an African-America n woman who has, relatively recently, relocated to Arizona. When I found that out, in jest I sent her an email telling her to be careful they don't mistake her for a Mexican.

She replied in earnest saying that she has already been rousted so now she carries proof of citizenship wherever she goes.

What a sad state of affairs! Reminders of the countries behind the old post-WW2 iron curtain.
+37 # robniel 2012-08-17 17:20
I can't wait for Brewer to circle the bowl. I used to vacation in Arizona. No more.
+3 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:30
I visited AZ several years ago thinking we would move there. After two weeks, I knew I could never be happy there. LOL! So we moved to Floriduh!
+27 # Barbara K 2012-08-17 17:32
Virginia: Yes, I have noticed. They all look like mean and ugly grouches. Even listening to them, they have their lines so well rehearsed that they rattle them off so that we (thankfully) have trouble figuring out what they are saying. We already know that whatever it is will be a lie. They couldn't tell the truth if it landed on their heads.
+12 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:12
If you ever sat with them, they are snarly.
Vying for love they got from servants, they turn on servants .... greed, lust for power. They turn out whores, just what mom and pop made them, male or female. After all mom and pop were whores also.
+15 # Barbara K 2012-08-19 10:26
KittatinyHawk: My late brother-in-law had a saying that I always consider with a big smile: "Beauty is only skin deep, but ugliness goes all the way to the bone. It has even more meaning as I look around at the Tbaggers and Thugs now. lol
+9 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:35
I totally agree with you, Barbara K. I have lived in Republican country for seven years now. These people can't tell the difference between right and wrong, Right and Left, good or evil, truth from lie. They will stand there and lie to your face and then announce that they are "a Christian".

We have the churches to thank for this ethics, morality, integrity failure. The churches have taken the message of Jesus, put it through the spin cycle and are pumping vicious behavior out through the Jesus Camps, the talking heads on Faux (sic) news and the churches (which are all bought and paid for by the Fourth Reich.)
+4 # Barbara K 2012-08-20 09:19
WestWinds: There is nothing religious about them. They are ugly all the way to the bone. They are a bunch of self-centered selfish lunatics. Nothing like Jesus.
+14 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:09
Clones, ugly, mean spirited and looks
+5 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:37
They have been zombified.
+21 # myungbluth 2012-08-18 13:20
Virginia, some people have an inner beauty that overcomes their physical deficits. However, Jan Brewer is ugly from the core of her miserable, graceless soul, and it shows in her face.
+2 # ghostperson 2012-08-20 01:04
Where I am from we say people (men and women) with skin like that have skin that looks like cold gravy. But for Brewer, it isn't just cold gravy skin, cubed, she has dead eyes seen in those who hate. Ann Coulter has the same look but with younger eyelids. Can't tell about Bachmann's squinty look because fake lashes weighted down her lids. Now that we have chortled at the ladies, let's dissect the men. Male haters seem to have no chins: Limbaugh, Rove, Beck. Maybe we need a scientific study. It would be just as good as the pseudo-science of the Koch brothers' bull shit research, science and civic study centers that exist solely to deny global warming and the toxicity of airborne pollutants and contaminants. I suggest a study be conducted in Charles or David's garage. The test subject will be asked to go into his garage, turn on his car, shut his garage door and see if he lives through the experiment. Of course, room temperature will be continuously measured throughout the process. Bet there would be not takers from the Koch bros.
+3 # Barbara K 2012-08-20 09:23
ghostperson: You are so correct. Have you noticed the no soul, dead eyes, of Romneyhood? He puts on his fake smile, but cover his mouth and look into his dead eyes. It must be a trait of the Tbaggers. They all have such cold, dead eyes.
-1 # Interested Observer 2012-08-20 11:09
I have noticed that if a sufficient number of pictures are taken one can find an unflattering picture of anyone even without assistance from Photoshop.
+38 # ABen 2012-08-17 15:22
As the lines of the article suggest, she is very ill-advised and has been ever since she got into public office. However, if you watched her in action in her gubernatorial debate with Terry Goddard or any of her rare press opportunities you know, were it not for other people putting ideas in her head, she would virtually have nothing to say. Like Sharron Angle, she is the public face of the "White Grievance" wing of the AZ GOP. She served her purpose by championing SB1070, and my rational Repub friends here in AZ tell me she will be allowed to slide quickly and quietly into anonymity when her term is up.
+12 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:13
Look at that Face...she wants no advice, she is in charge and know it all.

I just cannot believe she is allowed to stay in Office with her malintent towards those not of her phony color.
+93 # fishmother 2012-08-17 11:28
Brewer clearly is not one of the brightest stars in our current political universe, and I mean that in both senses. She is clearly not the smartest woman, confusing words like presence and status, exhibiting no understanding of the actual laws she tries to replace with the ones she likes to make up, nor does she get that pandering to the far right will not make her positions and blathering sound humane, just, intelligent or relevant. Plus there is no luster or humanity in evidence on her face, which is permanently set in an expression of desperate, pinched anger. How sad.
+48 # WestWinds 2012-08-17 13:37
Over the years, I have come to the personal conclusion that Right-wingers are the broken ones in our society. Far from being better than everyone else, with their born-again meme that "if you are not a born-again then you are nothing" as taught to them in the Jesus Camps. Their Right-wing leaders only go in for kooks and crazies. Have a look at Sarah Palin; the prom queen who uses the palm of her hand as a teleprompter and knows all about foreign policy because she could see Russia from her back porch.
(Wheeeeeeewww! Looney-tunes!)

I think the reason these people are so against a meritocracy is because they aren't good enough to compete and make it to the top (and they know it), so they go in for lying, cheating and stealing to get whatever they can.

Then, because they are the business class, they use all of their salesmanship skills to sell us on how great they are.

Meanwhile, they have such a small grip on things, all they know how to accomplish is one disaster after another culminating in one huge MESS!
-71 # chirostv 2012-08-17 13:51
I have to agreee with you. The absolute definition of sanity is Joe Biden and Rahn Emmanuel. Are either of these people qualified to do anything? Makes me long for the focus and intelligence of Dan Quayle
+49 # X Dane 2012-08-17 15:25
Biden is certainly not someone you would compare with Palin , Brewer and the other republican "Stars"?? He is a very smart man, who to the delight of the press and... many of us,... often says what he REALLY means. How refreshing!!

Most politicians pars their words and answer in such convoluted ways that it is next to impossible to tell what they ACTUALLY mean. Occasionally he makes mistakes....Who doesn't????.

But take a look at Biden's face? it is the face of a genuine human being, caring about others, it is friendly face.

Now take a look at Jan Brewer's She LOOKS like the MEAN nasty witch she is. Her eyes could melt steel. A real MEDUSA UGH!!
+20 # tm7devils 2012-08-17 17:45
I would rather look upon Medusa than kiss Brewer with my eyes closed!!!
+10 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:25
They do not have enough drugs or alcohol...she has shriveled herself up in hatred.
She is the role model of Hatred...we should show the children to come what it looks like. Pastor out west who also convoys the hatred instead of Love. His family is even more evil so I do not wonder of his cult.
+5 # Barbara K 2012-08-19 10:34
Big LOL! Still laughing. Thanks for the hardy laughter.
+11 # tm7devils 2012-08-17 17:57
This is short and you at least have a chance to understand it:
Biden & Emmanuel are more qualified to do ANYTHING, by 10 orders of magnitude, than you are of making a non-inane statement.
-4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:23
You probably could not understand the humans like Biden because you are not one.
Biden actually is a good man, actually gives a shit about people of all walks of life, promoted labor and fair health laws.
He also understand pain suffering and loss.
Clones however do not understand anything that is not programmed into them, Feelings...they have the look of the undead of movie fame. They have no glow, no luster. The few who did are gone, their sell out genes care only for things, money.
But if you could measure one third way to would not bash this person. I see no one ever need to bring him up. The Democrats are as useless as TPers when it comes to the P and VP. I have no respect for any of the Trash out there in Political Monkey Suits, they take up space that is far to valuable. More than likely you also
Q was a nice guy but intelligent, he didn't even hear his own party mock him. He should have left them went Independent. Instead he let the GOP bury him.
+2 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:49
Oh, yes. Dan Quayle with a wife covered in gold jewelry who said that people living in the projects do so because they deserve it; they are lesser people; like the rats they live with. Right, Dan Quayle and his wife are really great people and role models for us all...
+1 # bingers 2012-08-19 18:48
Quoting chirostv:
I have to agreee with you. The absolute definition of sanity is Joe Biden and Rahn Emmanuel. Are either of these people qualified to do anything? Makes me long for the focus and intelligence of Dan Quayle

Joe Biden is probably the best informed person in the country regarding foreign affairs and I'm not so sure his "gaffes" aren't intentional. But further, he has more value in his little finger than any 100,000 conservatives you could name.

Inasmuch as Rahm Emanuel is basically a Republican in Democrat's clothing I might agree with you on him to some degree.
-63 # JackB 2012-08-17 14:22
There are born-again Christians on the right. They are among the larger group called conservatives. If you insist that all conservatives are born-again Christians then I suppose you would have to go with all liberals being Godless degenerates.

BTW - regardless of your opinion of Sarah Palin she came to the table with a much more complete resume than Divine Barry who brought a blank sheet of paper. He has spent over three years proving his resume summed up his talent level.
+41 # phrixus 2012-08-17 16:50
Hmmm. Obama: Constitutional Professor of law, University of Chicago and US Senator.
Palin: Moron.

My BS detector is going off...
-4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:31
I do not believe their is a Christian or Faith Follower at all amongst the Nazis of GOP Fame.

Sheeple want to belong to the Cult, most know it is against the Teachings of the Creator.

Palin is actually a bargain compared to Bachman, Brewer and some others. She was just too trailer park foolish, believing GOP actually took her seriously.

If your Party who endorses you doesnot take you seriously, how do you expect the Citizenry to? You all make me laugh at your foolish remarks.

Save Your tizing isn't going to do it. You got to listen to the words of Love, Peace, Sharing We do not need Governments, they are obsolete. If we rid ourselves of Corporations, Government, then Military...we could live better than we can imagine. We just do not Believe in the Truth or Ourselves. Government is Evil...
+2 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:54
These days the real evil is coming out of the Pentagon. If you think the boys over there will EV-VER give up their money maker, you don't know what's going on.

As for Palin; she's a prom queen bimbo. Period.
+13 # rockieball 2012-08-18 07:44
Sara Palin come on now. She gave up and quit as Governor. She began that so called Freedom Tour that was to go to all the states but gave up after Washington D.C. and when the press did not report her every word. Much more on the table? Well oh yea she did admit to reading but could not remember what.
0 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:51
I have to give this a "Pants On Fire".
+9 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:16
She like the others are not dummies. She knows exactly what she is doing.
No sadness, she has none for anyone else..I am tiring of these people using power, religion for greed.
Would be nice if we could go back and walk in others shoes...perhaps she would understand the meaning of Need for Freedom.
Perhaps she would understand like all should, we whiteys were not here first.
+1 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 17:45
She is just one of the Republican women. No one can say any better of any of them least of all the likes of Sarah Palin or Michele Bachmann or Ann Romney (who drugged her lame horse to palm it off on some unsuspecting mark instead of getting the poor creature the best medical attention that their money could buy.)

All of these Republican women are ugly monsters. I had one of them cut me off so badly, my German shepherd dog almost went through the front windshield. I followed her and pointed out the danger of driving that way. Her response was (and I quote):
"I don't care at all about your damn dog. I'm trying to order here, so get out of my way." She will never know how close she came to getting a good sock in the nose!
+1 # bingers 2012-08-19 18:53
Thank you for not punching her. We need to show some respect to the mentally ill.
+93 # MEBrowning 2012-08-17 11:38
What is it about Republicans that they repeatedly and consistently pervert the laws and spirit of this country by being, by turns, mean-spirited, insensitive, selfish, greedy, narrow-sighted, paranoid, and flat-out stupid? I know there are kind, altruistic Republicans out there somewhere. Aren't they embarrassed and upset by the direction their party has taken over the past 30 years? Don't they see that they're being hijacked by what used to be known as the Lunatic Fringe? For heaven's sake, isn't it high time the MSM and other outlets stopped calling them "conservative?"
+16 # X Dane 2012-08-17 15:28

WINGNUTS is so much more correct
+3 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:37
I imagine they put the definitions in.
Creation ... Life.
Politicians..Life taking
Human Beings..Morons
Government ...Futile
Citizen United..unpubli shable
+2 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 18:01
Remember when they used to call themselves, The Moral Majority? Soon followed by every sex scandal you could think of? They don't call themselves that, or NeoCon, any more because it doesn't play well out here in Realityland any more and it doesn't get them the leverage they are looking for.

We must remember, the Right are the business people; salesmen. They have just done a bang-up job of selling us a bag full of sand. This is what they do. This is who they are. Truth and Fact and Reality don't mean a thing. The only thing that matters is transferring your money out of your pocket into theirs. Period, end of chapter. There is nothing else to them. They don't revere education, acculturation, the fine arts, savoir faire. They only want your money.
+65 # Stafft 2012-08-17 11:47
Racism by any other name is still Conservatism. ""Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!"
Seems like Brewer and her ilk have slammed the door shut. God Help America!
+48 # lanie940 2012-08-17 11:55
Jan Brewer is a disgraceful excuse for a human being, she deserves a special place in HELL
+9 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:41
She Lives in Arizona...Hell does not want these people. Would give Hell a Bad name.
+5 # rockieball 2012-08-18 07:45
Agree the Devil would hate the competition.
+10 # chirostv 2012-08-17 12:59
And do it LEGALLY
-49 # JackB 2012-08-17 14:33
Are you suggesting that people like Sharpton, Jackson & Obama are conservatives?

Perhaps you could share with us why liberals are so devoted to illegal aliens & have no use for legal immigration?

Do you honest to God see an advantage to this country in opening the door to illegals?

Divine Barry, who has done nothing to solve the unemployment problem, decides it would be a wonderful thing to swell the unemployment rolls by 1.2 million applicants. Doesn't get more brilliant than that.

Of course its his compassionate nature that is behind the decision. No chance he is ass-kissing the Hispanic voters. Nah. Not Divine Barry.
+10 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:48
Maybe we are understanding what We Whiteys did to the Indians
Who says those from South of the Border are illegals...seem you forget they were here first like the Indians. This Land esp Arizona was there land...DUH

If President was ass kissing he would have said no more Immigration Laws, let everyone in. DUH

Hey have you asked Trump how many Illegals he brought in to man his hotels In AC about 18 years ago he brought ten thousand Hondurans in, that was one trip. Now where do you think these people all found out abour America from. Perhaps the Maids, Gardeners, Labor the Rich brought here to work for nothing. DUH Realize that Blacks were brought here for slavery or did you miss that too in history?

racism would not end if all the immigrants, legal or not left...You need to hate like the Hunters who kill wolves, buffalo for trophies, need to kill. Your Evil
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:39
I am sure that is not all that is closed on her. Most of her is probably decayed or fossilized.
+56 # wwway 2012-08-17 11:53
Hate is written all over this woman's face. In fact, a lot of Republicans I know who are going along with their party have turned quite mean looking.
+32 # WestWinds 2012-08-17 13:18
She looks like an alcoholic; like a mean, nasty drunk. What a mug. No attitude of gratitude here.
-36 # JackB 2012-08-17 14:34
Next thing I guess is to say she looks like Ted Kennedy.
+15 # fishmother 2012-08-17 15:28
What? I think there are drunks, who unlike Kennedy, never got cleaned up & never made huge contributions to this country through the legislation he introduced and the liberty for others he fought for. So maybe West Wind & JackB you should try not to si ignorant & ill intentioned.
+9 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:50
No he actually had laugh, smile lines. His skin was not leather. He had life in his eyes.
0 # bmiluski 2012-08-20 10:12
Again...lack of civility. But ya know, you remind me of this homeless person that wanders around the neighborhood vomiting out negative proclamations because that's all that's left of him.
-42 # JackB 2012-08-17 14:36
Not the pure & undefiled look of a Harry Reid or Nancy Pelosi.
-112 # freighttrain 2012-08-17 12:02
These people are criminals and do not deserve the right to bypass existing laws on immigration. They will be taking jobs from the unemployed. The next thing is some will become unemployed and will start receiving unemployment checks. There are tons of reasons why these criminals should not be allowed a free pass. Gov Brewer is doing what Obama should be doing is protecting Americans from criminals.
-47 # JackB 2012-08-17 14:45
Good post. As I write this you are up to 41 negative votes. That's very good. 50 is a good indication of being dead on. I think you'll make it with ease.
+19 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:54
Nope it means you are in the slime zone
+1 # gentry cooper 2012-08-19 21:43
you certainly will and deservedly so.
+18 # ABen 2012-08-17 15:25
perhaps you should read the President's directive for some clarification of details and look at the history of immigration policy in the U.S. of A.
+5 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:55
Most of these Texters tell their computers what to write since they did not finish 5th grade. Parents sent them to school for GOP Standards. They certainly graduated.
+31 # suzyskier 2012-08-17 15:43
TQuoting freighttrain:
These people are criminals and do not deserve the right to bypass existing laws on immigration. They will be taking jobs from the unemployed. The next thing is some will become unemployed and will start receiving unemployment checks. There are tons of reasons why these criminals should not be allowed a free pass. Gov Brewer is doing what Obama should be doing is protecting Americans from criminals.

Taking jobs from the unemployed?? Most of the jobs you conservatives are always screaming about are low wage agricultural and farm jobs that Americans think they are too good for. Someone has to do them! Why are these children ( these people were children when they were brought here) how is that their fault??
I just think the majority of conservatives are nasty and cruel. You sound like Nazi's.
+3 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:56
Yes Jorge and Maria sold the Corporations to China. Now they are starving to death to enter America.

Trump great role model of jobs to illegals
+8 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:53
Hey my friends lost lots of jobs thanks to Trump bringing in tens thousand Hondurans and Costa Rica illegals to work his Hotels and Casinos in Atlantic City Alone.

Who care what she looks like...she is Evil and so are all who follow hate.

By the way...I do not remember this Hemisphere being White. I do believe these Mexican and Central Americans are actually grandfathered to be here much like the Indians. But then one would have to read and be educated to know History.
0 # bmiluski 2012-08-20 10:16
After Georgia passed its harsh immigration law in the spring, the state lost about 11,000 agricultural workers, and farmers were left with their crops rotting in the field because they did not have enough laborers to pick everything.
-119 # 2012-08-17 12:06
I'm pissed over the dream act as I have two kids who can't get entry level jobs because these damn illegals will take the jobs for less pay. Now, Hussein wants to make 2 million legal residents which means fewer jobs for Americans and legal residents. Hooray for Brewer!
+56 # MEBrowning 2012-08-17 12:45
My son is having a tough time finding a full-time job, but we don't blame kids like Zulleth Romero, any more than we blamed our ancestors for coming to the U.S. to find a better way of life.
+42 # mdhome 2012-08-17 12:59
So, you are going to vote for a republican that wants to lower the minimum wage?
-79 # chirostv 2012-08-17 13:18
Romeny and Ryan have no plans AT ALL to lower the minimum wage, that is simply an Obama talking point. Let me ask you this, So, you are going to vote for a Democrat that wants to destroy the middle class?
+44 # bmiluski 2012-08-17 13:35
Ah the old republican koolaide. Do you want to explain to me how giving the upper class a tax break and taxing the middle class will save the middle class? "Trickle down" DOES NOT WORK. It didn't work with bush its not going to work with romney. It's the middle class that buys the stuff the upper class manufactures. Why would you then tax them so they would have less to spend?
+30 # Majikman 2012-08-17 14:24
Every time I hear the term "trickle down" I have a mental picture of malfunctioning Depends. The repugs sure know how to frame things.
+28 # reiverpacific 2012-08-17 13:55
Mean-spiritedQuoting chirostv:
Romeny and Ryan have no plans AT ALL to lower the minimum wage, that is simply an Obama talking point. Let me ask you this, So, you are going to vote for a Democrat that wants to destroy the middle class?

The Rethugs have already made a pretty good job of that!
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:01
Repugs did try last spring, RSN, Nation, Rolling Stone I believe did stories. If not UK certainly did because the Media did not.
+36 # bsager892 2012-08-17 14:37
That Obama wants to destroy the middle-class is pure bunk. Romney wants to make two classes-rich and poor, with nothing in between. I live in AZ five months out of the year, and Jan Brewer is the Wicked Witch of the SW. She's become a daily pundit who gets about as nauseous as Sarah Palin with her bandstanding hateful rhetoric. She and the Sheriff of the Dark Ages make a good couple. Jan is just pissed that she can't run for another term-just another policy she's trying to change.
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:02
Joe gets it for free at the jails from both sexes... She is so atrophied she cannot even smile
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:59
I think you should back track here if you can actually use search...Wester n States were voted out on Referendum to put Min Wage back to $4 an hour.

This is the mentality of GOP
0 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:00
Quoting chirostv:
Romeny and Ryan have no plans AT ALL to lower the minimum wage, that is simply an Obama talking point. Let me ask you this, So, you are going to vote for a Democrat that wants to destroy the middle class?

In case you haven't been paying attention, the presidents who worked at the destruction of the middle class and who have succeeded in large measure were Reagan, Bush I and Bush II. No Democrats have ever worked against the middle class.
+6 # rockieball 2012-08-18 08:01
Mdhome they not only want to lower it they want to remove it altogether along with paying overtime.
Remember last July when Rep Bill Young (R-Fla) to a person when questioned about minimum wage to "Get A Job."
Rep Sean Duffy (R-Wi) last July actuall got in his car and drove off when asked about it from a 73 year old man.
+47 # WestWinds 2012-08-17 13:05
You on the Right keep blaming the wrong people for this. If the corporation, Monsanto, hadn't sacked the Mexican corn economy with it's genetically modified corn (guaranteed to grow only ONE season,) the Mexican economy would be strong. But your Right-wingers are the ones who have cheated you out of your jobs because they wanted the cheaper labor than you and your sons, and it is the US corporations that are hiring these illegals. If the corporations didn't offer any jobs to illegals, they wouldn't come here. You can't blame the Mexican people, either. They are the victims; they only want to survive and feed their families, but your Right-wing politicians and your Right-wing corporations are the ones who are the architects of this disaster. Put the blame where it belongs.
+21 # X Dane 2012-08-17 16:09
West Winds.
Bravo RIGHT ON. For many years our country and big corporations ESPECIALLY were exploiting poor people in other countries.

Monsanto is responsible for a wave of suicide of Indian farmers. They bought the same corn that Mexican farmers did. They are going broke, because they can not use seed corn. It is a tragedy for the them.

Many of our big companies are VULTURES. Wal Mart is another horrible outfit. They suck the blood out of poor people in many countries. Both the ones manufacturing their wares. and the poor scmucks working in their stores for starvation wages.

With NO health insurance.Aaaan d they destroy other businesses, when they come into a community, because they suppress wages, and kill the tax base.

SHELL drilled and polluted rivers in South America causing so much destruction and they refuse to compensate the poor mostly indigenous Indians. Law suits have been going on for years
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:10
DuPont flooded China and East as Well as South of Border with Lead Now we are getting it back a hundredfold, guess the Heathens read bible betterin us!
I can name hundreds of products that were sent to these third world countries because they were unsafe for us Americans.
Democrats passed those laws, Republicans helped their Corporate donation Buds find new place to dump toxic materials.
We were safe. Now we have more lead coming into our country in appliances, paints, rubber, plastic, fluids, food, plastic from China than is allowable in USA but CN doesnot have to follow these laws on imports. We can thank ReaGun, SR Bush, Clinton to now for this.
Do you realize every cup of coffee from your coffee maker has high lead in it. Then Your Faucets also exceed the allowable as other products. America has to follow law so we should buy American. You can put all the filters you want on...but where are they made?
Filters are not all that efficient. If you over filter...good bye nutrients.

Yep, sure can see those Mexicans who made Hershey take my job to Mexico. Same with Caloric in the 80's. Now the Mexicans have sold our jobs in ten years to China, India, etc. They are sooo rich they need to immigrate to America.
+1 # WestWinds 2012-08-19 18:08
It was rice that Monsanto sold to eastern Indians that had them committing suicide.
Monsanto is a scourge on the Earth.
+25 # David Starr 2012-08-17 13:26,

The B/W outlook strikes again. It could be possible that your own ancestors were not considered "Americans." That's in the past? Past and present connect, thus the hypocrisy can be more evident in the current attempt to, what it comes down to, finding "scapegoats" without institutional and corporate power. Blame those "opportunistic foregners." Buddy, there are jobs Mexicans, legal and illegal, that Americans wouldn't even think of doing. Addditionally, it would make more sense to blame how the U.S. economy is set up idealogically-s peaking. And those who maintain it: the Republicrats and their allies of the private corporate beaucracy, etc.
+1 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:03
It's not that Americans wouldn't do the jobs, it's that they won't do them for starvation wages.
0 # David Starr 2012-08-20 10:11

The point is well taken. It's inexcusable that immigrants such as Mexicans should have to,in economic desparation,lea ve their own country and find work in the U.S. for jobs that pay if anything,slight ly higher wages or wages that could border on what they would get in Mexico,combinin g that with other negative consequences resulting from parasitical economics. Runaway corporations operating in countries where the people are poor enough to take what they can get, (I guess that's called an "opportunity" for "lean and mean" coporations) but of course with the norm being starvation wages that are worse than wages in the U.S., or simply not being able to find work. Meanwhile, U.S. workers are out of a job from lay offs by the "runaways." It assumes a downward spiral of living standards either way. It's the nature of the "bourgois beast": virtually hoarding money where not even the sky is the limit. Quiet desparation could eventually turn to loud revolution if the monied "monarchies" do not renounce their predatory economics.
+32 # bmiluski 2012-08-17 13:32
Your rant would have so much more relevance had you not stooped to calling the President of OUR country Hussein. His name is Barack Obama. As for less pay, why don't you go and rant at the people paying these lesser wages rather than the entry level ones. And lets not forget, a lot of those damn illegals are serving in the military protecting your butt.
-25 # 2012-08-17 17:26
Protecting my butt from what? The only butts they are protecting are the Jews butts. We have no reason being over there interfering in their way of life. No son of mine is going to die for Israel!
+1 # CAMUS1111 2012-08-19 11:17 do you wear the swastikas on the inside or outside?
+3 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:06
Protecting my butt from what? The only butts they are protecting are the Jews butts. We have no reason being over there interfering in their way of life. No son of mine is going to die for Israel!

And there comes the Republican racism. Funny thing is that until recently it actually was the Democrats who supported Israel. They still do, but expect fairness from them.. The Republicans over the last 20 years have become rabid supporters because the nut jobs in the party expect that to bring on the apocalypse.
-30 # chirostv 2012-08-17 15:21
Hurray for jpacord!
+11 # ABen 2012-08-17 15:29
jpacord; perhaps you should direct some of your ire at the employers who hire undocumented workers.
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:13
I know Unions have gone to streets corners to fight back for over 15 years I wonder where these White Trash were that Church that blows up free clinics, or bashes gays to death?
+6 # X Dane 2012-08-17 20:24
You put you finger on it. Many hiring
undocumented workers are big agriculture businesses. They want cheep labor and so do big meat packing plants and chicken farms.

All kinds of menial labor very few Americans will do. Most of all these are republican owned, and they want to keep the undocumented workers, because they will work in horrible circumstances, blazing heat, no shelter and very few brakes.

So the big business republicans WANT to keep the undocumented
+20 # suzyskier 2012-08-17 15:46
I'm pissed over the dream act as I have two kids who can't get entry level jobs because these damn illegals will take the jobs for less pay. Now, Hussein wants to make 2 million legal residents which means fewer jobs for Americans and legal residents. Hooray for Brewer!

Yes they will take these jobs for less pay so what? How is that their fault? It is the employers that you should be angry with. The employers are offering these jobs at lower pay, not the immigrants. Too much hate here in the USA
+6 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:14
Start at your Politicians homes. Do you think Cheney or Bush's cared who worked for them cleaning the barns, composting the gardens, cleaning their crap.

Get a life, better yet, get an education.
Funny no one brings up Trump and his illegals
+24 # mayordoug 2012-08-17 16:47
Wait a minute! Haven't we been giving HUGE tax breaks to the "JOB CREATORS" for years, even decades now?? Where the hell are the jobs they have created with their tax breaks?? It has absolutely NOTHING to do with this program! Where are the jobs??
+5 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:16
In their vacation homes and cars. they are like the researcher labs. Not doing their Jobs.
OVR of Pa is a good example of waste of money of taxpayers. They do not get jobs or work with Ticket to Work but they get paid, vacations and benefits.
+11 # phrixus 2012-08-17 16:53
"Entry level jobs?" Like what, apprentice dishwasher? Gimme a break.
-22 # 2012-08-17 17:21
If I make it to 100 Negative votes I'll hold my nose and make a donation to Romney-Ryan. Let me add that many of these Dream Act kids are drug dealing gangsters that now can't be deported. Hooray for Brewer and Arpaio for running them back to Mexico where they belong.
+5 # phrixus 2012-08-18 08:50
And you know this how, exactly? What are your sources? Where is your empirical evidence to support such a claim? Or are you just making this up without any data whatsoever?
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 19:58
Yah and let's get Obama for selling those Corporations to China.
If your kids have your level of mentality, tell them to go to Walmart. Or better yet run for Office in Wisconsin or Arizona
+4 # robniel 2012-08-18 11:06
[quote name=""]I'm pissed over the dream act as I have two kids who can't get entry level jobs because these damn illegals will take the jobs for less pay.

I assume your pissed because you spent so much time preparing them to enter the job market with appropriate skills.
0 # bingers 2012-08-19 18:58
So arrest the principals in the corporations that bring illegals here to work for substandard wages. Republican politicians love illegals for that reason.
+25 # Doodling 2012-08-17 12:13
Yes, Gov. Brewer reminds me of Hilly Holbrook in The Help. I take that back, Hilly makes the "Gubnor" look like a bleeding heart humanitarian and a civil rights activist in comparison. Come on, AZ stop allowing this beautiful desert scape look like Alabama at its worst 60-70 years ago.
+14 # cycleman60 2012-08-17 12:19
Jan Brewer has a problem with Obama. She has a heart-on for him. She doesn't realize her time has come and gone.
+48 # riverhouse 2012-08-17 12:21
The conservative cheering in AZ will stop when the cost of the lawsuits Brewer just guaranteed begin to show up in AZ's state budget.
+15 # mdhome 2012-08-17 13:00
Justly deserved.
+18 # ABen 2012-08-17 15:37
riverhouse; Your are correct on the coming lawsuits. Many of us who have lived in AZ for decades saw this coming when Brewer got into the governor's seat by default. Being an intelligent, open-minded person in AZ requires one to have a well developed sense of humor.
+20 # tuandon 2012-08-17 12:40
Brewer is a demented cow.
+22 # David Starr 2012-08-17 12:53
Jan Brewer has shown another example of a rather, ethically bankrupt "proto-aparthie d" policy that the Right blindly embraces; this in the face of many whose European ancestors may have been once "undesirables" in "Free and Equal America" and who did flee catastrophes, etc. in thier homelands. And I wouldn't doubt some at the least did get in by "hook or crook." Their descendents seem not to be bothered by their ancestor's immigration status but cry out in Brewist fashion regarding immigrants who immigrate to the U.S. by "hook or crook." Regarding survival, no one should be considered illegal. (B/W and shades of gray)"Old white people" are clinging to a relic of a U.S. kind of ultranationalis t patriotism, opposing "undesireables, " i.e., "young, brown people," while ignoring their own ancestors' history where some, out of desperation, found any way to get into the "Land of Opportunity." Hypocrisy is obvious. Given white racism being predominant in U.S. history, I wouldn't doubt some of these "True Americans" have it on their minds, perhaps closeted, or not, of these "inferior foreigners" and "wetbacks" coming in to "steal" U.S. jobs. They have it assbackwards in regard to the root causes of this issue. U.S. foreign in Mexico has been, putting it mildly, an interference where U.S.-backed candidates seem to win a presidential election every time. Then come the NAFTA/"Free trade"/Austerit y policies resulting in further deprivation for common Mexicans; thus, desperation (Contd)
+9 # mdhome 2012-08-17 13:01
She certainly look undesirable to me. When does this witch's term end?
+3 # jerryball 2012-08-17 13:45
That catalogue d'raisonne includes many African-America ns who now enjoy Civil Liberties that many gays marched in Freedom Marches for. Now many of the African-descent are protesting AGAINST the gays who freedom marched for the African-America n cause. They are holding up that same Bible that was used against them in their struggles for Civil Rights. Circle of life?
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:20
Too many African Americans are listening to the same people who would love to have them back on the reservation and working for nothing. GOP. I find it disgraceful that any Minority would ever join with such garbage. Pastors are one reason cause the want the money!
-59 # chirostv 2012-08-17 12:56
These criminals need to be sent home in chains today! They are breaking our laws (not suggestions) and laughing about it. If the bleeding hearts that subscribe to this trash feel the need to support them they should do it with THEIR money and not mine. I prefer to spend my money on defense to keep criminals out by setting up fences and whatever else is needed to keep them out. Profile if we must.
+17 # hillwright 2012-08-17 13:32
"and whatever else" If the fences don't work I am sure you have a "final solution" in mind".
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:21
They gonna get them guns at trade shows from upstanding NRA Members and kill kill, kill
+26 # reiverpacific 2012-08-17 14:05
Quoting chirostv:
These criminals need to be sent home in chains today! They are breaking our laws (not suggestions) and laughing about it. If the bleeding hearts that subscribe to this trash feel the need to support them they should do it with THEIR money and not mine. I prefer to spend my money on defense to keep criminals out by setting up fences and whatever else is needed to keep them out. Profile if we must.

Now THAT'S a good example of the kind of mean-spiritedne ss the article talks about bred by ignorance of the world around the circumspective right-wing mindset.
Every time I hear the term "Bleeding-heart s" it is followed by this kind of anti-social rhetoric for which the US has become more and more renowned since Reagan.
Next time you eat in any kind of restaurant, especially the more expensive kind, watch out that your meal isn't being prepared by some hard-working non-lilly-white cook or even chef and consider who picked the vegetables you are exercising y'r gnashers on. They many times have these jobs because they are good at them and can take direction (I seen this up close).
I love the quip by a Latino comedian talking about the wall proposed between Mexico and the US; -"So who' dey gonna get to build it"? Heh-heh (Evil chuckle).
Bon appetit and watch where you spit yer venom, it might explode in y'r face.
+15 # suzyskier 2012-08-17 15:48
Quoting chirostv:
These criminals need to be sent home in chains today! They are breaking our laws (not suggestions) and laughing about it. If the bleeding hearts that subscribe to this trash feel the need to support them they should do it with THEIR money and not mine. I prefer to spend my money on defense to keep criminals out by setting up fences and whatever else is needed to keep them out. Profile if we must.

Gee I suppose your ancestors were greeted with flowers and wine. Take your hate to the Middle East and enjoy the hate fest there.
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:22
Go with Rush
+17 # tadn54 2012-08-17 18:54
It's really becoming nauseatingly repetitive to hear idiotic, narrow-minded and uber-bigoted white KKK-esque bozos complain and whine that "I hate paying for THOSE people!!

Hey, we all pay taxes for crap we don't want or like. I didn't like paying for the worst-president -of-all-times' wars, based upon his ego and outright lies, or tax breaks for the oil industry and zillionaires with gold-plated car elevators,and especially, the salaries of an absentee, useless Republican congress. I don't have children either, but I would never bitch about pitching in for public education.

Heartless, unempathetic sub-human morons.

Read a book every now and then with actual sentences and poly-sylabbic words leading to coherent and enlightening THOUGHT. Laziness and stupidity lessen your ability for critical thinking, which, by the way, right-wing educators want to abolish.
-2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:20
Why don't you lead the way...and stay there
+1 # phrixus 2012-08-18 08:58
Perhaps if we had a realistic path to legal immigration in this country we wouldn't have so many "criminals" running around. Put them in chains and send them back? Then what? The chains come off and they are back next week gardening, harvesting our agricultural products, washing our dishes and busing our tables, babysitting our kids, installing dry wall, plumbing, fixing cars...are you detecting a theme yet?
+16 # Acupuncher 2012-08-17 12:57
I Keep Asking MySelf "What are these People Thinking??" But Lately I have Been Far More Concerned about What the People Who VOTE For these Scoundrels are Thinking... That is The REAL Question... Are They Just Afraid Or Do they Just REALLY Believe That If You Can't Make it in this World BY YOURSELF, Than You Don't Deserve To Be GIVEN ANY BREAKS What so Ever...
+24 # billeeboy 2012-08-17 13:13
Perhaps the Federal government should simply give Arizona back to Mexico from which we stole it in the first place. Then the nasty Brewe becomes the illegal alien!
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:24
Amen I have said this about the whole bottom tier. From Florida to AZ go back.
Mexico and Central America doesnot want them. If they could get rid of the bigots perhaps but too many white trash and not enough jails.
-33 # Eldon J. Bloedorn 2012-08-17 13:14
Canada has a law on their books-"migrate" illegally to Canada-mandator y one year prison sentence. I've often thought that "letting" illegal immigrants into this country-how much different is this than unofficial slavery. First Africans, that came to an end. Now the spanish. Suppose the agricultural farmers, clothing industry paid a DECENT LIVING WAGE. That the U.S. has Universal Health Care (which it seems we now do.) Rather than "Americans" women having babies, go on welfare-sorry you have to work the fields. No welfare except in need as one is out of work and looking for work because of no fault of their own. we Americans who do work just don't like supporting insincere people who find it easier to not work, just have baby after baby. I know, this is a simple solution, it is more complex, but, it is a start.
+3 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:31
They are stopping support to mothers having up. Laws change from state to state but Medical and Welfare are cleaning up.
Yes if everyone illegal was put in jail we would be feeding them three meals a day, paying electric, paying for laundry, clothes, cable, and so much more. Now think about this...we also send them to college. Yep let us put everyone in America into jail who is working on some farm, in some toilet,..and let's have to build more jails and prisons to house them. That could be like Nazis and the Concentration Camps. Wow what a concept.
Perhaps we should actually try teaching them, befriend them, and let them pay their fair share. But like morons we seem to be. We want to shoot them, because no more will come. I have tried that with squirrels, but funny thing is they multiply and then I have more.
I believe the 1% who are killers should go to War, because everytime we "pay for court time, and deporting them" Taxpayers money is being wasted. DUH They come back, now know how not to do the same crap, they get paid to bring others in with them. Yup, our way is certainly Ground Hog Day
+3 # Eldon J. Bloedorn 2012-08-18 11:21
Bottom line. The agricultural and clothing industry "bribe" the legal system. They want cheap labor and they get it any way they can. The Spanish "slavery" is not as cruel as the early U.S. history African slavery, but it is still a form of slavery. Has anyone taken the time to examine where and how the migratory workers live while working the fields?
-56 # kwiac1 2012-08-17 13:15
I betya most of the people who disagree with Brewer are part of the 47% of the Anerican family who don't pay any fed tax. Why, of course they can be very charitable with the other 53% tax revenues. We all want to help ALL good people, but you need order first. Illegals should not get benefits utill legal and have earned them by becoming a citizen.
And Obama's back door, politically inspired methods reek, especially in this case. That's why he's going down in November.
+18 # bmiluski 2012-08-17 13:39
So you're saying that all the illegals that are serving in Iraq and Afghanistan should be sent back?
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:35
After they are toe tagged.
+15 # bmiluski 2012-08-17 13:40
Jan Brewer reminds me of the women that think just because they follow the "boys" club edicts they'll be accepted. Foolish women. To the boys they'll always be girls and girls just don't matter as much.
+24 # reiverpacific 2012-08-17 14:12
Quoting kwiac1:
I betya most of the people who disagree with Brewer are part of the 47% of the Anerican family who don't pay any fed tax. Why, of course they can be very charitable with the other 53% tax revenues. We all want to help ALL good people, but you need order first. Illegals should not get benefits utill legal and have earned them by becoming a citizen.
And Obama's back door, politically inspired methods reek, especially in this case. That's why he's going down in November.

I'm not a citizen and I've paid into S.S. all my US working life. Wanna take that away too do ya?
And if you wish to harp on about back doors, check out who's back doors the bag-carrying corporate lobbyists have such easy access to.
And where do you and your deluded ilk get the 47% who don't pay taxes -backup required here and I don't accept FOX News as credible source-? -Of course, I'll bet my bum that you'll be one of the Ryan-lovers who are anti-tax for the wealthy while the rest of us pays their whack!
0 # Diane_Wilkinson_Trefethen_aka_tref 2012-08-17 18:03
[quote name="reiverpac ific"]And where do you and your deluded ilk get the 47% who don't pay taxes -backup required here and I don't accept FOX News as credible source-?

Sorry, reiverpacific. kwiac1 is close enough for government work:
“Close to half of U.S. households currently do not owe federal income tax. The Urban Institute-Brook ings Tax Policy Center estimates that 46 percent of households will owe no federal income tax for 2011. [1] A widely cited figure is a Joint Committee on Taxation estimate that 51 percent of households paid no federal income tax in 2009.[2] (The TPC figure for 2009 also is 51 percent.) [3] “

However, “In 2007, before the economy turned down, 40 percent of households did not owe federal income tax. This figure more closely reflects the percentage that do not owe income tax in normal economic times.[4] “

You owe KW an apology for calling him/her deluded.
+5 # reiverpacific 2012-08-17 19:33
Quoting tref:
[quote name="reiverpacific"]And where do you and your deluded ilk get the 47% who don't pay taxes -backup required here and I don't accept FOX News as credible source-?

Sorry, reiverpacific. kwiac1 is close enough for government work:

You owe KW an apology for calling him/her deluded.

I perused the links and learned nothing. Is "did not owe" the same as "did not pay"? -Or for that matter "avoided paying by whatever means available?
I'll be first to admit it if I make a mistake or misquote but this is all shallow speculation. The point d'appui being that those who try and make an anti-tax case via this road are the first to cry "Too much" when egalitarian distribution is intended or needed. But what of imbalance as is now the case?
I'd still like to see some real backup.
See it yet?
-5 # Diane_Wilkinson_Trefethen_aka_tref 2012-08-17 21:58
Kwiac1 said 47% of American families don't pay federal income tax. He was off by 1%.
You insulted him by calling him deluded and asked for proof.
With proof rendered, courtesy of the Brookings Institute, you show your lack of cajones by failing to man up and apologize.
Instead you defend your insult with a comment about "owe" vs "pay".
I said you were wrong in calling him deluded (you were) and that you owed him an apology for that (you do).
RSN says, "Avoid personal attacks on other forum members...Remem ber that making the world better begins with responsible action."
Your posts on this point have violated both those guidelines..
+7 # X Dane 2012-08-17 20:49

I'll bet the 46% who pay no federal tax would love to do so, for that would mean that they made SOME REAL MONEY, and not the puny wages, so many people have to live on these days. They do pay Payroll tax.

Many of these people USED to make good money, but have had to take any work to survive.
0 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:36
I figured they meant the railroad workers and the Politicians and their servants?
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:34
Are you talking about the Railroad Workers or Mitt Romeny's crew

Order...What order more government, more hatred, more killing? That order?
More paying companies to go overseas? that order?

Order...sounds nice, looks good on paper, all that paper but it does not work. We started out with simple Law Ten Commandments but they were not good enough, man needed more rules, more regulations, more laws, more amendments, more amendments to the amendments to the amendments to the law that started as a bill that amended and amendment. Do you understand that Order? If so teach us.
0 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:13
The 47% you're talking about don't pay income tax, but they still pay lots of taxes which takes more of their income than Romney pays in income taxes. But you should note that he's studiously avoided saying he paid INCOME taxes.
+7 # David Starr 2012-08-17 13:16
(Contd) a similar kind of desperation that some white's ancestors dealt with. Thus, changing the U.S.'s imperial foreign policy could be a major step for the people in Mexico to create change that benefits the masses, thus lowing the odds of illegal immigration; along with eliminating austerity measures. That is, working for their country's interests within it. I think that's the most common sense policy with Mexicans literally deciding thier country's policies for many to create stable conditions; thus, no or hardly any "foreign flood." The Brewists of course don't take this important factor into consideration, blinded by illusions of granduer of the "USA" being "exceptional," of being the "good guys," and thus, a B/W outlook which at the least, is infantile, while at the most, dangerous. If the Brewists , etc, are so literal about foreigners "invading" the "homeland," then they've already lost the argument given that their ancestors were once foreigners, legal or not, combined with broken treaties and stealing land from the First Nation people (Native Americans). Again, if this is literally taken, as the "True Americans" are taking it, then the land or most of it, in principle, should go back to the various tribes since they are literally indigenous to what is now called the USA. Sounds absurd? Then so is the Brewists, etc. argument and policies to keep out the "illegal invaders."
+17 # Davethinks 2012-08-17 13:22
Acupuncher asks the critical question, which is - How do these people get voted into any office at all. Bull Conner has been replaced by Sheriff Arpaio. Old governors of Mississippi, Georgia, Alabama, and other deep south states are re-incarnated in Brewer. But the citizens of the beautiful state of Arizona voted the creature into office. Why? What is the matter with these people? Are they all born with hearts seven sizes too small, black as anthracite, hard as obsidian, lacking humane virtues?
-40 # chirostv 2012-08-17 13:43
None of the above David. They are good people that are tired of people breaking thier laws and then having a self serving individual like BHO reward them with citizenship because they broke the law. Were all liberals born with a brain 7 or 8 sizes too small?
+15 # Eduardo3 2012-08-17 17:26
(1) If anybody broke any laws, it was the parents who brought them here - not the children.
(2) Obama's new policy does not reward ANYONE with U.S. CITIZENSHIP. It just allows them not to be deported and to be able to work. You are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts.
+3 # ABen 2012-08-18 08:26
Eduardo3; well said! However, I suspect the ears you are speaking to are quite deaf.
-34 # freighttrain 2012-08-17 13:31
Let me tell you a little about the minimum wage...there is no way our company would hire anyone that would work for minimum wages. Why? They always cost more in administrative cost than they are worth..they always want something changed, always complaining...b ottom line they are an overhead a business cannot afford. Prior to the last increase we hired high school students and worked them in every department that was legal so they would have a taste of the real world and have they would job experience to put on a future application. In hiring these students we knew they would be a cost and make no money for the company. An investment in our youth and America. Since the increase in wages we have not been able to hire these students. Get your own business before you make you unfounded comments.
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:41
Must be East coast co because West Cost just got voted own on lowering mom wage last spring

Have not been able to hire these youth because then we wouldn't have bonuses every quarter so much for students.

I love the kids but I understand companies costs. Most kids esp the Yuppie ones, do not understand getting job and keeping it since most jobs do not have incentives anymore. If you want to train them to push carts, mark items, stock, they will do it until a better one comes along.

Guess ya get what ya give!
+1 # David Starr 2012-08-18 12:54

According to your "logic," you won't hire anyone for minimum wage because "they" will want something always changed, always complaining, and an overhead business can't afford?" But you'll hire students for the same wage and they'll also turn to be a "cost" to the company? Yeah, there's the altruism of investing in youth. But it appears that, despite training, the economy, especially in its current state, is comprised of minimum wage or subsistence wage jobs, plus, "working" to finding a job (who knows how long that could take)then being lucky to get a job. The investment, in this manner, does not sound "profitable." Perhaps many students and others, in quiet desparation, are taking what they can get, if there is something, or clinging on to what they have; and companies, in quiet desparation, finding any way to lower expenses, whatever they can get away with, to make a profit. Meanwhile, the few who have too much, and getting much more, don't worry too much because of a solid financial buffer to weather periodic economic chaos and crises. This is all the more resembling the Gilded Age, i.e., a "Great Leap Bacwards." To paraprase Charles Dickens, It is the best of times, for the few, and the worst of times, for the many. The U.S. economy appears more to characterize an economy, I repeat, of quiet desparation...f or the many, be they workers, students and/or some small businesses.
+7 # jerryball 2012-08-17 13:41
The Bitch Is Back!
+23 # walt 2012-08-17 14:18
Brewer is a like the entire Republican Party-miserable , mean-spirited, hate-filled, and bigoted. She even looks it in her very physical appearance. And she has showed outright disrespect to a US president as well.

When will everyone wake up and reject everything the GOP stand for? They are destroying the USA.
-20 # MainStreetMentor 2012-08-17 14:39
I'll be voting for Obama - because voting for Romney would be a death knell for America. However, having said that: Zulleth Romero had six years in which she COULD have become an American Citizen - as did her mother. Six years! They are here illegally, as such, they are law breakers, and as law breakers they need be deported - at the expense of themselves. Sorry ... that's just the way it is.
+17 # Eduardo3 2012-08-17 17:22
Main Street, you are ridiculously ill-informed about immigration policy and reality. They did NOT have a way to legalize their status during those 6 years, much less become U.S. citizens. Obama's order gives these young people - who came here as CHILDREN - a way to at least not be deported and be able to work. It still does NOT offer them a path to citizenship. ... You call them "law breakers" as though they were common criminals. No, most immigrants who come here by crossing that desert are fleeing dire poverty and are just trying to survive and feed their families. That applies to the adults and teens who come by themselves. Young children who come with their parents had no say in the matter, so how do you get off penalizing them for the choices their parents made?
-6 # MainStreetMentor 2012-08-17 19:14
The parent(s) of Zullet Romero should have applied for American Citizenship - and included any and all children in that process sometime during a period of six years. ANYONE can apply for US Citizenship. In the early 1900's poverty drove people from Europe to the USA - and THEY became citizens! An "illegal immigrant" IS a law breaker! "Illegal" means: NOT LEGAL.
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:50
Those who turn 18 can go into any Welfare Office and start. Everyone is to blame if you see my statement.

But when you willingly allow time to go by, it doesnot look well and I do not care what color or race you are. Believe me Russia, Asia have done the same.

People here are showing the Racism they harbor...they do not care if these people are citizens, they hate anything that is not white. Funny thing is there is no such thing as white person. It is an impossibility if the Bible is right. If we came for Aliens well again impossible to know what we were.

I hope when it comes time you and all those in this Country who can Vote...Vote GOP out. They are everything that breeds Racism. Sorry we have these creeps but we do as does all races, religions
+5 # X Dane 2012-08-17 21:06
It is sad that so many otherwise kind Americans have so little compassion for people who just want to survive and help their children do better. Most people here ..illegally,.. miss their families, and would rather be home, but for them it is a matter of survival. Pure and simple
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 20:46
I blame Counselors for not getting the kids help. But the hatred, even violence towards them keeps them quiet.
Now how did the children get educations if the school did what they are supposed to, verify. They don't care, every head they have is money in their district so why lose thousands of students?

I agree both were negligent and should go back. Those who graduate should walk into an Immigration Office or Welfare and ask to start the Process. I do not know if you can on computer but once you are of age..get help. That goes for any race, religion whatever.
Imagining Mexicans are the only illegals is not only being racist but a blind one
+3 # bsager892 2012-08-17 20:58
I am a world traveler. I meet many Americans who live in other countries. They are just as bad as the Mexicans who come here because they will not learn the language even though they have been there for many years-whether it's Italian, Spanish, or French.
+2 # reiverpacific 2012-08-19 09:42
Quoting MainStreetMentor:
I'll be voting for Obama - because voting for Romney would be a death knell for America. However, having said that: Zulleth Romero had six years in which she COULD have become an American Citizen - as did her mother. Six years! They are here illegally, as such, they are law breakers, and as law breakers they need be deported - at the expense of themselves. Sorry ... that's just the way it is.

OK, dig this: I've never seen it addressed in the press here. The FEE for applying for US citizenship almost doubled recently from $600+ to well over $1,000; I actually considered it myself fora bit but the US won't let me retain my EU/UK Citizenship which I'm not about to give up (it's OK to be dual at the other end).
Consider then, that this huge increase may be rather daunting for someone who does menial, less than minimum wage work with a family to support. -And it's convenient for many cheapskate US employers too, including some rich and famous ones and some highly placed in government (check it out, there have been plenty of instances delightedly reported in the trash owner-media in recent years).
I know many do manage to scrape the basic fee together but wonder how much the huge increase is just too daunting for most any more.
I also read that many are now going back to Mexico and beyond as this country deteriorates ever further into mean-spiritedne ss and diminishing opportunity.
+16 # fishmother 2012-08-17 14:39
Everything you need to know about this woman is written on her face!
+11 # jwb110 2012-08-17 15:30
One of these days she is going to find out exactly what the powers of the Commander-in-Ch ief. We are still in Middle East conflict. If nothing else she lacks much in the patriotism and seems to have trade that away for racism.
+9 # fraleigh44 2012-08-17 15:44
It is a misnomer to say 53% do not pay any Federal Taxes. They pay payroll taxes which is indeed a Federal Tas, if they are even paid with a check. The anger of many readers is an example of the continued debate as to who is the real Americans. We are the land of supposed opportunity and people migrate to us for this reason. Most if not all Americans do not choose to work in the fields as the work is "to hard for them". A direct quote from a friend whose family owns hundreds of thousands of acres of farmed land in Arizona and California. I for one find this hard, meanspirited behavior so unbecoming it is just difficult to read yet alone look at the face of evil reincarnated. Obama and Democrats for 4 more decades. May the elephants rest in their miserable hate.
0 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:20
That's a lot of crap. When I was in the Army I was stationed for a while in Yakima Washington and as a side job I picked apples and hops. Yeah, it's hard work, but lots of Americans were doing it before companies saw a way to stop paying fair wages for the ework and started importing Mexicans to work for a pittance.
+9 # jerryball 2012-08-17 15:46
Well, I for one will avoid driving in or through Arizona with all those unlicensed, uninsured drivers throughout the "God enriches" state.
+15 # suzyskier 2012-08-17 15:51
All of us are from immigrant stock except the American Indians and look how they have been treated. We are a country that has a lot of hate in our past, it's time to stop being full of hate, put yourself in someone elses shoe for once.
Jan Brewer is the reincarnation of the Wicked Witch of the West. Someone please throw some water on her!
+5 # Urbancurmudgeon 2012-08-17 16:05
Yeah but look at that face. You ever see as mean spirited a face as that. Even a mother couldn't love that face.
+9 # Eduardo3 2012-08-17 17:04
I abhor Brewer for her actions, but criticizing her for her looks and calling her a "witch" is just stooping to her level - it's as sexist and ageist as she is racist.

That said, this recent news only strengthens my resolve to BOYCOTT ARIZONA - with the exception of businesses that are owned by people of color.

I don't know about the legality of denying people driver's licenses, but from a practical standpoint it seems bound to contribute to more unsafe drivers on the road - because most of these young people are going to drive anyway; they just won't have passed any driver's test. Congratulations , Ms. Brewer. You have found a way to be both cruel and idiotic.
+5 # Majikman 2012-08-17 18:31
" criticizing her for her looks and calling her a "witch" is just stooping to her level - it's as sexist and ageist as she is racist."...not quite, Eduardo3. As young women, a face is a gift of nature. As an old woman, one has the face one has earned...and her hatred and ugliness has migrated from the inside to her face.
+7 # angelfish 2012-08-17 18:08
This Cretin who serves as Governor of Arizona is the Best example of ALL that's wrong with the New ReTHUGlicans. They ARE Punitive, Mean Spirited, Self-serving "ME Firsters" who seem to delight in hindering the Public Welfare rather than making it better. They are anathema to EVERYTHING upon which this Country was founded. Really, they're more to be pitied than vilified. Just remember to get out and VOTE in November and never, EVER Vote ReTHUGlican!
+1 # Archie1954 2012-08-17 19:55
She wasn't available to meet because she was taking a joyride on her broom.
0 # bmiluski 2012-08-20 10:22
Please, witches were the healers of the tribes/villages . To suggest that she is a witch is a HUGE insult as she is the antithisis to someone that brings the woman's touch.
+2 # 2012-08-17 20:38
When I saw her photograph the first thing I thought was, even before I read the headline, she has the George Wallace scowl. What a bigot!
+1 # bsager892 2012-08-18 13:20
She's on the news every day in AZ, but you don't see her smile very often. She seems like a very unhappy person.
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-17 21:00
I know how foolish we are when I read racists reviews.
I wish these racists would actually get some learnin, because to assume they are white no less right is very funny. There is not white race. Our bleach job came from migration, food, weather, cave living.

I do not know also of these uneducated, how they have any say about who stays. That was taken away here in the USA when we came and killed Indians, the name of God and Greed.

Brewers should be allowed to rot in the sun. We hope that all those who are allowed by declaration to be here, leave these Hateful States, get other states the tax base. Become Citizens, Get Id, Licenses than go back to Arizona and other States and buy them up.

White Trash...your a minority. I would start praying because God Created Us All Equal. Racists are no better than their intentions are to do harm to other Human Beings. I donot care how your Heathen Religion interprets the Bible. There is no Racism in God, Creator, Allah. Man wrote the books, is not perfect. Man has issues of hatred, denial, anger etc. Some fester in these, the rest of us walk away from it.
I can smile, breath, enjoy life because I hate no one. I wish no one harm not even the Politicians.
0 # charsjcca 2012-08-17 21:50
Umm. If a person who does not exist, the undocumented, how could they ever get a drivers license in any state? How do you prove your non-existence?
+4 # wilma 2012-08-18 09:19
The Governor would be the first to criticize if these young people did not have the initiative to work by saying they are lazy, etc. Now that The President is making an effort to encourage these young people to be productive she is trying to thwart this positive effort.

Instead she should be concentrating on the real issues like health care for all, the unemployed and the hungry.
+3 # reiverpacific 2012-08-18 10:38
@ "Kwiac1" and especially "tref".
So your comment on "lack of cojones" is civilized discourse is it Bubba? The likes of you are good at hurling insults from a safe distance like all the reactionaries around where I live.
So rather than engage in a prolonged war of words with you "deluded" types, here is what I found DIRECTLY FROM THE BROOKINGS INSTITUE WEBSITE under the heading. "WHO PAYS TAXES?"
"A popular myth swirling around Washington, DC, and throughout the media these days is that many Americans do not pay taxes, and are therefore free-riding off of our society without contributing themselves. This has even been referred to by some as a “new orthodoxy.” The origin of this misconception is the observation that only about 54 percent of American households paid federal income taxes during recession-affec ted 2011. But that statistic is misleading because it provides an incomplete picture of the overall tax burden on American families, and because it incorporates individuals who naturally shouldn’t be paying taxes because of their age or economic circumstances due to the Recession. A closer look reveals that nearly all Americans do, in fact, pay taxes".
For the rest of the article by Michael Greenstone and Adam Looney read on @
I'm not above apologizing when I'm wrong -so are there two or more Brookings Institutes? The foregoing is what I call "Backup".
0 # barbaratodish 2012-08-18 23:27
If BEING legally present was a requirement for driving in all the 50 states, very few would qualify, because instead of BEING at all most people are ABSENT -to reality!
+1 # bingers 2012-08-19 19:25
Mitt Romney has been complaining about hate and anger from the left. Governor bonefinger is the perfect example of that. Oh, wait, she's a Republican. No surprise, since all the hatred spews from them, but yes, we're angry about the evil caused by and continued by every republican politician and a majority of those stupid enough to vote for them.
0 # skeewiz 2012-08-20 01:52
This really makes me sick. I keep going over and over in my head that I can only invision her as a very evil peoson, similar to that of one who ran the death camps in Europe during WWII. But their jobs were morbidly routine in comparison, her's seems to be hell bent on distruction of anything that is foreign to her morbid reality.
+1 # vince47 2012-08-20 13:56
As a resident of Arizona I find her pandering to the right offensive. She is consistent and really out of touch with reality. She would rather fight than try and solve problems. She is about 120 years out of date with her thinking.

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