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Marcotte writes: "Rep. Paul Ryan, now a nominee for Vice President, has a long history of speaking of women as if they are non-sentient beings, while seemingly imbuing even fertilized eggs with the sentience he won't grant women."

Republican vice-presidential candidate Paul Ryan speaks during a town-hall meeting campaign stop in Manchester, New Hampshire, 08/20/12 (photo: Reuters)
Republican vice-presidential candidate Paul Ryan speaks during a town-hall meeting campaign stop in Manchester, New Hampshire, 08/20/12 (photo: Reuters)


She's Just an Easy-Bake Oven

By Amanda Marcotte, RH Reality Check

27 August 12

 

he good news about the Rep. Todd Akin situation is that it genuinely seems to have raised the public's awareness of how much the anti-choice movement is rooted not in some love of fetal life, but in a profound misogyny that focuses heavily on fear of female sexuality. Akin's ready assumption that women frequently lie about rape to cover up their sexual adventures was a perfect example of the demonized view of female sexual liberty driving the anti-choice movement, one that has very little relation to how women actually act in the world. But the exposure of the ugly, misogynist heart of the anti-choice movement might come at a price: Other dehumanizing, ugly attitudes towards women expressed by anti-choicers might seem more moderate by comparison.

For instance, Rep. Paul Ryan, now a nominee for vice president, has a long history of using incredibly dehumanizing language towards women and speaking of women as if they are non-sentient beings, while seemingly imbuing even fertilized eggs with the sentience he won't grant women. Even though he's no doubt been strongly coached to try to at least mimic compassion for women, the notion that women have internal lives and experiences that matter just doesn't seem to factor into his discussion of reproductive rights. Instead, he just falls back on talking about women as if they're nothing but flesh-bound ovens to cook male heirs. Which, naturally, led to the same kind of minimization of rape that Akin is accused of engaging in.

During an interview with WJHL this week, Ryan was asked his view about Rep. Todd Akin, who recently asserted that women could not get pregnant from "legitimate rape."

"Specifically where you stand when it comes to rape, and when it comes to the issue of should it be legal for a woman to be able to get an abortion if she's raped?" WJHL reporter Josh Smith wondered.

"I'm very proud of my pro-life record, and I've always adopted the idea that, the position that the method of conception doesn't change the definition of life," Ryan explained. "But let's remember, I'm joining the Romney-Ryan ticket. And the president makes policy."

As usual, he struggles to even acknowledge women. Rape is just a "method of conception," relegating women to the means of conception, instead of, you know, people whose experiences, hopes, and fears actually matter. He might as well be talking about cooking eggs. Some people scramble eggs and some people make omelets, but no matter the method of cooking, it's still eggs! Ryan may accept that perhaps raping isn't the preferred method of sperm delivery to the vessel, but at the end of the day, the only thing that really matters is that the sperm got delivered and that the vessel not be allowed a say in the matter.

At least Todd Akin granted women enough agency to be considered liars. Ryan doesn't seem to have even given that much thought to the proposition that women have minds working behind their eyeballs.

When talking about rape, the ugliness and dehumanization of women is much more obvious to the public, but it's important to understand that this utter unwillingness to see women as people - instead of just Easy Bake ovens that make people - is shot throughout anti-choice sentiment.

Fundamentally, the debate over abortion is a debate over what we make of the fact that some of us in this world can have babies. For pro-choicers, "being able to make babies" is a nifty thing to be able to do, like being able to play the piano or being able to bake pies. It's your skill, your ability. You should use it how you like. We would no more force a woman to make a baby because she can than insist that someone who can play the piano drop everything they're doing at a moment's notice to play because we want them to.

For anti-choicers, the fact that someone can make a baby means that making babies is what she is for. People mistake the term "objectification" to mean "looking at with lust," but what it actually means is "reducing someone to an object to be used." Sexual objectification is assuming that because women turn you on, they are for sex, instead of a person whose sexuality should be an expression of their agency. What anti-choicers engage in is reproductive objectification. Women are among an array of objects to be used. The refrigerator is for storing food. The bookshelf is for holding books. The woman is for making babies. You no more give her a choice in the matter than you would give your refrigerator veto power over what food it holds because it didn't like your method of shopping.

What we need is for people to sit up and really listen to language like "method of conception," and not just because it minimizes rape, but because it's part of a larger way of perceiving women as nothing but vessels. We denounce the pseudo-science and magical thinking that led Akin to claim that rape can't cause pregnancy, but this entire perception of women is also based in magical thinking. The unwillingness to see that women are fully present human beings, instead of baby factories that were unwittingly given the right to vote, also defies basic scientific understanding.

It's not like the evidence is inconclusive to draw the conclusion that women are people with subjective experiences, just like men. Women have basically been telling the world this since the beginning of time, no matter how much pressure is put on them by patriarchy to instead act like compliant robots that shoot out heirs. Women have always expressed feelings, created art, and had dreams. Women communicate their personhood all the damn time. Anti-choicers just simply refuse to see the evidence in front of them, instead projecting all this sentience onto embryos that don't actually have any feelings or thoughts. The inability of the anti-choice movement to see reality is about a lot more than their misunderstanding of how human reproduction works; it's the very foundation of their entire worldview that relegates thinking, feeling, communicating women to the status of inanimate objects.

 

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+70 # CandH 2012-08-27 13:35
I'm gonna go with the Renegade Raging Grannies on this one. They've recently put up a nice little ditty on the subject of Legitimate Rape: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Anc_gP2_QeI&feature=player_embedded
 
 
0 # M. de la Souche 2012-08-28 10:25
Or, for the Youth Market:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mg_4O6XmKAQ&feature=related
 
 
-80 # Eduardo3 2012-08-27 13:55
I can understand the outrage against men like Akins and Ryan - but this article overlooks the agency of all the women who consider themselves "pro-life". There are many, and they are just as sentient as "pro-choice" women. (I put both labels in quotation marks because I think the "pro-life" movement all-too-often shows no concern for the lives of human beings once they're outside the womb, while the "pro-choice" position does not give the fetus any choice on whether s/he gets to live or die.)
 
 
+37 # Capn Canard 2012-08-27 15:57
Eduardo3, your concerns are duly noted. But very heart of the outrage here isn't necessarily about abortion so much as RAPE. I suppose it is abuse of a woman's body for the purpose of male dominance. The fetus is another completely different story altogether. At least that is way I see it... but I am man and like many men I could've gotten it all wrong.
 
 
+21 # Sophie 2012-08-27 21:37
You are correct, you have gotten it "all wrong."
Go back and read the article again--please.
 
 
-13 # X Dane 2012-08-27 21:47
Capn Canard.

In my opinion you got it exactly right
 
 
+20 # mjc 2012-08-28 12:39
Rape isn't so much male dominance as it is male rage, rage coming from some source inside the guy that makes his sexual organ a weapon, THE weapon of choice, even if he has other weapons available. It isn't sexual attraction and it isn't desire to be a father. It is violence against a woman who may or may not represent other women or a certain inadequacy the raper feels about himself.
 
 
+59 # Carbonman1950 2012-08-27 21:20
It does not overlook those women's agency, but it does assume a fact in evidence... that those women agree with these authoritarian men and have voluntarily abdicate their agency and responsibility. Put another way, they have, apparently, handed their independent agency to men who, through their words, show that they believe women are incapable of independent agency.

But I'm curious... in what universe is a fetus capable of making any choice? Certainly not this one.
 
 
+104 # Uppity Woman 2012-08-27 21:25
Eduardo3, There is a lot of shallow thinking and misunderstandin g in both genders that drives the anti-choice movement which seeks to eliminate women's reproductive rights. There is a lack of understanding of when a soul begins to inhabit a fetus, a lack of historical perspective about how childbearing has been used to oppress and exploit women, and a lack of awareness of how truly difficult it can be to raise a child without support. As a group, we also have some unexamined, unconscious beliefs based on an old reality, and many are operating as if these still hold true.
Pregnancy and childbirth have been for women the traditional equivalent of military service for men. Both require people to risk their lives for the good of the whole (presumably!), and there have been times when it was necessary to compel this service. It is no longer necessary however, and no one should be compelled to risk their lives, either through compulsory military service, or compulsory childbearing. Not all men will be good soldiers. Not all women will be good mothers. We do not need more war, and God knows we do not need more people. What we need more than ever is a sustainable birth rate and infrastructure, and cooperation among all people to save our beloved planet. Once we get this clearly in focus, we will be able to move into a healthier dynamic and the issue will die.
 
 
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:21
Great thoughts
I do hope you are right that future generations can come away from the need for competition between who God make better. Until we can rise above our dissent, we will continually need to label everything.
 
 
+64 # Sophie 2012-08-27 21:36
You have willfully missed the entire focus of this excellent piece by Marcotte--which is the HUMANITY of the woman.
The rights of the woman should not be superseded by a zygote or fetus.
The "pro-choice" position is that a woman has a CHOICE-- so your comment is the usual anti-choice meme.
 
 
+105 # Majikman 2012-08-27 21:47
Against abortion? That's your right to not have one.
You have absolutely no right whatsoever to tell any woman what is her right to decide on her own private health issues. That's between her and her physician.
 
 
+13 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:28
No it is up to her. Her Physician, Counselor, Family can all support her or negate her, hopefully give her alternatives that are safe. But the choice is up to us for every decision we make, we must live with it. I do not care if I ask my spouse, I still have to make the decision with my heart, my mind, my soul. I ask my spouse so we can mutually discuss, look at all points but in the end...decisions are his to make, and mine to make. We must live with it. What we share from it is how we support each other. No one should ever believe others can make or should a decision for us. Once we give that up, whether male or female, what do as a Person have. I will listen, I will research but I will not follow. I will not lead the lamb or sheep to slaughter. If you know me, then you must follow Your Thought and make Your Decision. I will stand by you thru your decision because I care that much.
 
 
-41 # tahoevalleylines 2012-08-27 22:08
Suppose a bright young Biological Science doctoral candidate writes a detailed narrative of the hourly development of a zygote/fetus? The DNA pair-up between the egg and sperm takes place in the initial five cell divisions.
If DNA is fully effectual as determinant of the microscopic fetus' physical details, the Constitutional status of the future baby takes on the qualifications of Constitutional protection, as in, "Life, Liberty and Pursuit of Happiness. Could be, Caesareans, not abortions will be an acceptable means of transplanting a fetus to a nurturing environment?

Science makes case regarding personhood, catching up with religion, as science tends to do. Battles in the Supreme Court ebb and flow until the evidence, not hopeful thinking and political correctness prevail. Kneejerk if you like, where do you think the discourse finally arrives?

The seriousness of life has as much to do with careless use of reproductive organs as many other cases where life and death may be determined by deliberate or accidental behavior. Chain of custody (care of the child after birth) concept is part of the solution set. State denial of abortion implies government responsibility of unwanted babies...

Soon, events in the Middle East, Climate Change, Energy and resource supplies will get back to the political arena, and the constant fooling around over sexual behaviors and consequences will simply not seem important enough to dominate.
 
 
+55 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 06:02
Human DNA is in every human cell. Do you know how many human cells are in a dust rag? Carefull the next time you vacuum. You may be committing mass murder.

Semantic arguments about "future potential" rely on religion to make them work.

Your side of the argument relies on the ability of a minority to impose its religious opinions on others who disagree.
 
 
+51 # mdhome 2012-08-28 06:08
State denial of abortion implies government responsibility of unwanted babies... Yes, Until the government agrees to support those rape babies, they have no right to make the women bring the rapists sperm to a complete baby. If someone goes into a mom/pop store and steals the contents of the cash register, shoots the owners, does that mean he should be given the store? Sounds about the same as being forced to raise the result of a rape.
 
 
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:34
interesting analogy Thanks
 
 
+45 # Brooklyn Girl 2012-08-28 06:19
"Science makes case regarding personhood, catching up with religion, as science tends to do. "

False. The exact opposite is true. Religion catches up with science. Apparently you have never heard of Galileo.
 
 
+21 # Regina 2012-08-28 10:41
It took the Church three centuries before that hierarchy understood Galileo. My students need only a few weeks to understand classical gravitation. "There are none so deaf as those who refuse to hear."
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:34
Amen
 
 
+20 # slkayne 2012-08-28 07:27
tahoevalleyline s: The phrase "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" comes from the Declaration of Independence NOT the Constitution. While the Declaration of Independence is a fine document, it does not carry the weight of law that the Constitution does. I receomend that you read it sometime -- it's not a long document and is available online.
 
 
+4 # nemonia 2012-08-28 09:51
Analysis of your comments leads me to belive you are not a "sentient" being. Since you are clearly not a "zygote/fetus", it would seem you have no potential of ever becomming one in this life. Perhaps you will be reborn (thru "Caesarean"?) as a woman.

Give your head a shake and see what falls out.
 
 
+17 # vegaspat 2012-08-28 10:18
Perhaps it would help if you gave your head a shake....I AM a woman who has had a child (wanted). I was treated as an equal by my husband who also helped care for our caughter. I do not appreciate the attitude toward women that is prevalent now. God gave us free choice, so who can take that away from us? Male or Female, your body is your own and no one else should have any power over that.
 
 
+3 # nemonia 2012-08-28 10:47
My reply was to 'tahoevalleylin es' not 'vegaspat', and it is clearly pro-choice. You can tell what comments go with what by the order on the page and the level of indentation. As far as comprehension of their content, well, thats your problem. But rant on. I agree with you, but I wouldn't want to go to a shooting range with you.
 
 
+23 # James Smith 2012-08-28 10:15
"Science catches up with religion?" That is the most ridiculous statement I have heard in my life. Science has to kick religion in the ass repeatedly to get the religious reich to budge an inch. For example, the sun does not revolve around the earth. Nor is the earth flat.

I think I have just seen the ultimate in absurdly asinine remarks. Congratulations , it seems we have an all-time winner. That one will be difficult to top.
 
 
+6 # CL38 2012-08-28 11:31
You'd think that would be very difficult to top, but at the competitive rate they're going, someone is sure to say something even more stupid any day now!!
 
 
+16 # James Smith 2012-08-28 10:19
Here's one for al ofl you religious reich anti-abortionis ts. Guess who is the most prolific abortionist of all time?

Your god is. From 25 to 50% of all pregnancies end in spontaneous abortions. If you sincerely believe your god controls everything, he must be responsible for this. When are you going to start picketing god?
 
 
+13 # Regina 2012-08-28 10:44
Yes, and the religio-politic al storm-troopers have been heard threatening women who "mis-carry" with criminal prosecution!!!
 
 
+10 # CL38 2012-08-28 11:29
Don't kid yourself. If they achieve what they hope, that's probably on their long list of (hidden for now) criminal offenses women could be facing!
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:33
If a woman so wants to carry the fetus to this point and allow someone to have this seed. that is her decision not sciences right.
When you start deciding to open women up and take kids out, will you then just let the mother die because she refused to deliver these children or child or dead eggs which they could be? Because that could very well be the mentality in that future you speak of. It has been done I am sure.
Religion I do not believe there is much Religion left. I believe it has come undone..it is only a money environment now. Power Play. Religion like Politics have no business in anyone' decision making.
You want children, go have them, go adopt them but let us women alone. We do not have to follow, and most will not follow Lunatics
 
 
+1 # Reyn 2012-08-29 09:19
I agree with the idea of transplanting the fetus to a nurturing environment. I think that will be doable fairly soon without invasive surgery in fact. At that point in time the question of abortion as it now exists will truly become a moral one - for all people, not just the fringe. Now however, it isn't an option, so for now the real question is whether we force people to bear unwanted children or not. I strongly support the right to choice, but I would prefer another option. Let me say with Secretary of State Clinton "Safe, legal and rare."

Birth control or very early post conception birth control (the morning after pill) are MUCH better solutions than abortion, and despite the continued opposition of the hard Right, who basically don't want people having fun, although they'd never admit that was their driving force, are acceptable to very close to all people on moral and ethical grounds.

As for the rest of your argument, only idiots ever thought that fetuses were going to become dogs or pigs -- that isn't a real issue, some extremists on the pro-choice side MIGHT come up with something like that, but no one treats them seriously, just like no one really treats "abortion is murder" seriously. Of course fetuses are human - and again, careless or not, just use birth control.

As for energy and climate change - oh yes, they will, and they will further stress the need to reduce population - perhaps before you think.
 
 
+76 # X Dane 2012-08-27 22:39
Eduardo 3

I sure DO think the right wing ONLY care about the fetus, for they CONSTANTLY refuse help to mothers, healthcare for children, help to young women in college....a number of them are mothers trying to educate themselves to better care for their children

Caring about our citizens with disabilities is MOST certainly PRO LIFE. But the right wing are ONLY interested the fetus.

To me that is a simple matter of wanting POWER OVER a WOMAN. NO BETTER THAN A RAPIST WANTING POWER OVER HER.
I BET you didn't think about THAT.

Any woman should have the right to terminate a pregnancy, It is HER body and a pregnancy can impact her life negatively, and make it very difficult for her to reach the goals she has set for herself.

If for instance she is going to college or if she already has a child or children, and simply is not able to care for more at this point, then it is HER decision, NOBODY else

I have a feeling that republicans WANT her to have the baby for... BAD WOMAN,... you had sex, now here's your punishment. Many republicans are so repressed sexually and if they are also Catholics it is a double whammy. SEX is dirty. Now you PAY??
 
 
+30 # opinionaire 2012-08-28 05:16
There would also be the question about why a woman would be the sole person responsible for the actions of two people, at least in the case of consentual sex. In the case of rape, there is only the one person-the perpetrator-who se "needs" are being considered. That is repugnant. Also, abortions are considerably less dangerous for women in the long run than pregnancy.
 
 
+29 # Alice 2012-08-28 06:24
Abortions are only considerably less dangerous when provided safely and with medical supervision, a right that the Republicans seems determined to deny women.
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:45
Exceot their own believe me the rich kids having abortions are just as republican as can be many Dems too
 
 
+7 # Regina 2012-08-28 10:46
Thanks to the rabid rightists, there is now a new category of rape -- political rape!
 
 
+15 # X Dane 2012-08-28 10:46
I even forgot to mention that these zealots also want to make it next to impossible for women to get birth control??

I find it hard to understand, unless their aim is to totally repress women.
it is very difficult for a single mother to work outside her home AND also do a good job BRINGING UP HER CHILD.

I realize some of you will disagree with me when I say, that many children get in trouble, falling behind in school or scrapes with the law, because their mother can not be everywhere. It is hard to enforce, YOU ARE GROUNDED, when you have to be at work.

Other children DO have two parents, but again they have to work, and so they give the children too much STUFF, because they feel guilty about not being home enough

The sad truth is that far too many children do not get the attention and help they need.

So if a woman feel unable to take on the responsibility of bearing and caring for a child. It is HER RIGHT to decide to end the pregnancy.

There are too many children
 
 
+11 # Majikman 2012-08-28 12:06
X Dane: "I find it hard to understand, unless their aim is to totally repress women". Bingo!
They are indeed the American Taliban. Like their ideological peers, their next step, of course, is to accuse and imprison the rape victim for inciting the rape...just as they want to prosecute women for miscarriages.
They're probably totally bummed that witch burning went out of fashion.
 
 
0 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:46
Never too many children There are too many bad parents of all colors, races, religions and class.
 
 
+2 # X Dane 2012-08-29 21:33
kittatinyHawk

I made a correction to an earlier paragraph, and accidentally clicked, send before I could delete : there are too many children
 
 
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:44
Pro Life is a Yuppie Fad. When much of the pro life started it was people with not children condemning third world countries for having so many out of jealous rage.
Then they started when birth control became more available to women, families.
Jealousy is not a reason to hate women for doing necessary things so they can live thru Rape, with certain death if carry full term. Selfish Rich Kids were and probably still are the ones having abortions...the ir parents could afford it. Poor, Middle Class could not afford it whether monetarily or religiously in many cases. They lived in past in their assumption of shame and the kid with the kid suffered psychological scars due to such antiquated beliefs.
Now it is a Platform. It is a Power Play. If every one wants a child so bad than go take those fosters kids in, adopt children with health problems. These children are no less children of God or whomever.

No these children will go thru hell, see glimpses of hope .... and the fight against women abortion or taking birth control will continue. It has been very much so since the fifties. Now it has nothing to do with saving the life of mother or child, keeping mom alive for her family It is a Political Agenda and I count phony Religion as nothing but Political Agendas It is all about Control, Money
 
 
+46 # Ralph Averill 2012-08-28 01:14
Eddie,
You prove the author's point by leaving the personhood of the woman out of your argument as well. If a pregnant woman believes she cannot give a child all that a child needs to grow to be a happy, productive adult, it is HER choice, and hers alone, to abort the pregnancy. In an overcrowded world, (see story below on food shortages,) this is absolutely necessary. But in any event, it is the woman who chooses.
 
 
+27 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 05:55
The problem with your conundrum about "choice" is that you imbue fetuses, embryos, and zygoats with a choice that most Americans don't believe they should have. Your worries about the "agency of women who consider themselves pro-life", is a red herring. This is about people's rights to make individual choices, rather than the rights of people to IMPOSE their religious beliefs on others. The pro-life argument is religious. Our Constitution prohibits the intrusion of religion into American law and government.
 
 
+10 # wrknight 2012-08-28 06:51
Unfortunately, it does not although I believe it should. The first amendment merely states "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion or the free exercise thereof; ---" That, I'm afraid, doesn't prohibit religion from influencing the establishment of laws.

Now if you want to petition to amend the Constitution specifically to prohibit the church from influencing the state, I ask only that you allow me to be first to sign.
 
 
+5 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 08:34
If we think the ability to write laws rests in the hands of the legislature (i.e. Congress), then ANY laws prohibiting abortion (short of those created by referendum) WOULD be unconstitutiona l. Congress WOULD be both promoting a religion and prohibiting the free expression of another religion.

If the state wants to use religion to make laws IT IS unconstitutiona l and it HAS ALWAYS been viewed that way since the Constitution was first written.
 
 
+5 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 08:52
"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof", thus building a wall of SEPARATION BETWEEN CHURCH AND STATE."

-Thomas Jefferson (1802) (in a letter to Connecticutt Baptists)

It's pretty clear how JEFFERSON interpreted it.
 
 
0 # hobbesian 2012-08-31 02:55
zygoats??? oh! zygotes, no? (although I bet they'd be cute with their hairy little chins. )
 
 
+34 # wrknight 2012-08-28 06:34
How about all the sentient "pro-lifers" who supported Bush's war in Iraq, who support capital punishment, who support the National Rifle Association and who oppose gun controls? It seems that life is only sacred while it's in the womb and its open season once delivered.
 
 
+13 # Regina 2012-08-28 10:49
That's the Republican version of population control -- bear 'em first, slaughter 'em later.
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:49
Excellent...the y refuse to argue this point.
 
 
+6 # bmiluski 2012-08-28 10:27
Ummm, do you want to tell me how a zygote makes a choice?
 
 
0 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:18
It is very true that the movement only loves babies, kittens, puppies everything else is disposable or someone else's problem.

But Pro Choice Adults have given consideration of Birth, Child, raising from the beginning thru. Pro Life do not think, they are told what to say from birth.

They whole thing is what does a man have to do with our body... These men want to treat us like slugs then they have no say and should never been allowed to have children of their own. Most of these sorts only want Males, a world of Males only Guess that could be a Homosexuals Dream Come True even a pedophile's

I believe we have lots of closet queens in the GOP. I never met so many hateful men of women in such a Party except among Gay Men. Gay Old Perverts a whole new ring.

Men esp gays are jealous of women, and our closeness to God, our ability to have children. They forget in their rage, that we know we need to work together on the conception, women have no problem with it. Men have the problems and do not yet want to deal with them like men. They instead resort to low life mentality. Akins and Ryan are finally the Role Models of what we should be away from Men who hate and abuse women. One needs not raise a hand to be abusive...attit ude, words, are just as damaging
 
 
0 # JJS 2012-08-28 16:24
RSN censored me:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11437628
 
 
+26 # karlarove 2012-08-27 20:16
Does that method of conception give me immaculate status?
 
 
+37 # CL38 2012-08-27 20:38
I wonder about the wives and daughters of men like these and the extremely limited relationships they have with them, given the way they choose to see women.
 
 
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:53
Men oh believe me mothers and grandmothers have taught some very strong concepts into children including hate from knee high to adult.
Men left the women to the women. Mormons definitely in their conditioning of still meeting in private, no woman's opinion ...scares that religion out of me.
Lil Girls were the cutesy items that came to play, show off for company. Opinions, wow rich I know didn't think women had any opinions except on shopping. I was lucky since my family never had such biasedness towards women
 
 
+26 # balconesfalk 2012-08-27 20:47
The underlying reason the far rightists want women to deliver as many babies as possible is to drive productivity and expand capitalistic markets.
It is not about any moral imperative. It is more people, more soldiers for the wars, more demands for products and services--more, more, more. Why if women were not prevailed upon to have all the children humanly possible it might put a dent in corporate PROFITS. That's what's really at stake.
 
 
+39 # railroadmike 2012-08-27 21:11
Ryan and the rest of that bunch in the Republican party have plans for women. "Womens world is her husband, her family, her childern and her home. We do not find it right when she presses into the world of men". -Adolf Hitler
 
 
+52 # ghostperson 2012-08-27 22:43
We are just one hop away from a 17th century-type inquiry into whether women have souls. The quick answer is "yes." More soul I dare say than the male idiots whose party of deregulation and anti-human beings has taken the country down financially repeatedly since deregulation came in vogue in 1980. Women were better off in the 50s. Abortions were illegal in the 50s and remained so in the 60s and early 70s and long before. Women had them all the time. Women my mother's age had them. She was born in the 1920s. Women my age had them. I was born in the 1940s. Women didn't ask permission. They just did it. Then, as now, pregnancy was the woman's problem. The other half of the equation got to skip off into the sunset, unfettered, to dip his quill with abandon. I had a friend in college who got two girls pregnant. One, a Catholic, did not have an abortion. She became a "whore" in the eyes of the community. The other, a cheerleader, had an abortion and she sailed along unsullied. When society condemns sexual behavior but only as to one half of the coital partnership, demonizes the same half along with the offspring while offering safe harbor to the other half, what do you think is going to happen? Society can't set the building on fire, then, lock the windows and doors and not expect an frantic person to escape through whatever means they can. Men who think women are brood mares need to inflict themselves on like-minded females and stay the hell out of other womens' lives.
 
 
+25 # Alice 2012-08-28 06:29
Yes, women had abortions, but many died. Wealthy women always had choices and always will; the poor, not so much. There is no excuse to deny safe, medically supervised birth control and/or abortions in the 21st Century to ANYONE WHO WANTS IT.
 
 
+59 # Anarchist 23 2012-08-27 23:29
It is really quite offensive that men who cannot get pregnant get to make the laws for those who can without any regard for women's independence of thought. P.S.-if you object to abortion on religious grounds-too bad. The Constitution guarantees (or used to) separation of Church and State. Abortion should be a medical procedure not a theological argument with living women's bodies and lives as the battleground.
 
 
+8 # wrknight 2012-08-28 07:04
I agree fully with what you say except that the Constitution never guaranteed separation of church and state. This was an unfortunate omission that should be amended. The other unfortunate omission had to do with the role of corporations in our society. That also needs to be amended.

And if you think about it, you could easily make the argument that established churches are no more than religious corporations.
 
 
+38 # MindDoc 2012-08-27 23:30
Mitt used the day off due to what he'd call a precipitation phenomenon, and used it to pose for the nightly broadcast TV 'news' (Faux). His wife watches as Mitt has fun actually *flipping* a pancake in one of his lovely homes, as his wife stirs the batter. Right on cue 'the mrs' coos that she just bought Mitt 3 shirts at Costco (learned a bit about senior life, real people, and Florida, have we?).In fact she bought 3 shirts (on sale you think?) - since she bought them he's been wearing them all the time and 'loving it'. Nice ad for Costco.

My point: not only does this report describe the misogynist party-within-th e-party and provide a "reality check', but it underscores just how obsessed the campaign messaging machine is with trying to re-shape the overwhelming reality, and paint a "typical normal life" image. (Do you believe it? Can 3 days re-invent him?)

Ryan's healthcare goal is notable for the harm it would do to seniors (yes, the next generations, aka today's voters). And women? "No healthcare for you!" No "choice". It's not part of the Rand-Ryan plan which further enriches the 1%'s 400 families, while taking our country in a draconian leap backward , imposing social engineering and questionable rather than fixing roads or schools. Or the economy. They're quite the duo! Toxic assets in the truest sense.

But no worries, beams Ryan, it only effects generations to come...
 
 
+21 # Alice 2012-08-28 06:33
Brilliant comment! I saw the same clips of Romney and wife. They love to portray themselves as the "typical" American family. Husband working (or collecting millions in long-term capital gains; i.e., low-tax assets), wife at home with the kiddies, baking, primping, shopping. That America is long gone for 99% of us; and it has been for at least 30 years.
 
 
+17 # BeaDeeBunker 2012-08-28 00:08
A simply brilliant article!
The clearest, most concise yet.
When we use language to communicate, we must learn that words matter.
Her suggestion is right on the mark:

"What we need is for people to sit up and really listen to language like "method of conception,"

I often wish for the power to put the likes of a Paul Ryan, into a lockable device I call a truth chair. Similar to a lie detector, this chair would force the occupant to be logical, rational and objective. One could not mince words, obfuscate or dilly-dally (a very precise, linguistic term).

Once locked in the chair I would debate him. I would ask him to defend his stated position, that if one is not pro-life, one is anti-life. He can't, and thus loses that argument forever. STRIKE 1!
Next, I would hit him with the fact that the opposite of pro-choice is anti-choice. He would argue this point, but being in the truth chair, he would lose. STRIKE 2!

Ergo, if he is NOT pro-choice, he is anti-choice. I would bombard him with the following facts:
If he CHOOSES to own a gun, he is pro-choice.
If he CHOOSES to be a Republican, he is pro-choice.
If he CHOOSES to have milk with his coffee, he is pro-choice.
If he CHOOSES to be a jerk, he is pro-choice.
STRIKE 3! He's out!

I release him from the chair, a pro-choice advocate and proven hypocrite.

He resigns & opens up a free abortion clinic in Plainsville.
 
 
+12 # bmiluski 2012-08-28 06:43
I'd like him to be raped and then pregnant. Let's see how Pro-Life he'd be then.
Remember......If men had to give birth, abortion would be a sacrament.
 
 
+35 # James Smith 2012-08-28 02:50
It seems the point here is Ryan's attitude toward women, no pro- or -anti-choice.

To me it's clear that Ryan regards women with the same disdain and contempt with which he regards all of the "lower classes." That is as nothing more than tools to be used, then discarded when they no longer serve their (in his mind) purpose.

ELecting this elitist jerk to anything would be a mistake far larger than electing George W. Bush twice.
 
 
+6 # wrknight 2012-08-28 07:08
That's a tough call. When you get two mistakes so terribly bad it gets hard to distinguish them. It's like trying to tell the difference between two wells, both of which are over 10,000 feet deep, but one is one foot deeper than the other.
 
 
-1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:56
He is gay, I believe all the clones are, what else do they know, can relate to than others like them.
The women clones...well they are voting like they actually know what they are doing yet do not have a clue that they are supposed to represent woman and child point of view. Clones stayed too male after all they do not want Clones to have thoughts of their own.
 
 
+20 # vgirl1 2012-08-28 03:31
Why is so much of majority America willing to ignore this narrative such that they seem all too willing and eager to vote for this ticket?

Just asking.
 
 
+11 # bmiluski 2012-08-28 06:45
Because if you haven't noticed, the republican party is very much like a cult. Ergo the large amount of rightie religious nuts following their republican puppet masters.
 
 
+8 # Regina 2012-08-28 10:54
Because his opponent is Black.
 
 
+26 # kalpal 2012-08-28 03:37
I have always been amazed that a living breathing human female is expected to sacrifice her life for the potential of a fetus or embryo growing up to be another right wing doofus. No matter how conception occurred, via rape or a pleasant interlude, carrying a fetus or embryo or full fledged single cell potential human, to term is not only a 9 month project. It involves many years during which those who fought to preserve the embryo will ostracize the mother her entire life and viciously discriminate against her offspring, thereby imposing a life sentence for the crime of being female and having been violently attacked and sexually abused by a male.

Now please explain where I am wrong about how right wing society supports the offspring of a rape and its mother once the child takes its first breath?
 
 
+17 # Alice 2012-08-28 06:39
The Personhood Amendment, which both Ryan and Romney support, goes further than this. It says that if you are carrying a nonviable fetus, you must carry it to term and then, via Cesarean section at 9 months or whenever the body attempts to rid itself of the nonviable fetus or infant, deliver the dead fetus, even though infections and other problems can occur through continuing to carry the nonviable infant. In the case of the Personhood Amendment, the womas is truly only a vessel.
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 12:59
Cesarian section is always the last thing any doctor or vet wants to do. That again shows the stupidity of those making laws regarding birth
 
 
+1 # Cassandra2012 2012-08-30 13:45
Yes, because these males believe women are nothing but 'filthy vessels' (Thomas Aquinas.)
And women who go along with such base ideas have no respect for themselves as full human beings.
 
 
-20 # Joris 2012-08-28 04:25
If you watch the video, you start subtracting the hate. I am as liberal a person as can be and proud of it, but the whole Attack here is liberal "Rove-ian"--the speaker said nothing more than that conception can happen from rape--a position distinct and contradictory to the Congressman last week. DON'T USE HATE and attack. Let us not be like Karl Rover and "them." Let this one go. As presented, it is a lie.
 
 
+16 # pbbrodie 2012-08-28 05:30
You obviously missed the whole point of the article and the importance of understanding language and how it is used. It most certainly isn't a lie and there is no indication of hate. That is something that comes from your interpretation and nothing else.
 
 
+29 # dick 2012-08-28 04:40
Idiotology driven economics is one thing. But rock hard rigidity about things as personal & intimate & emotional as sex & childbearing is over the line. Libertarians of the Right should take a real stand here. Ask the Imposers to Back Off, or F..Off.
I think Ayn Rand's rigidity, for example, appeals mostly to young males who've had sand kicked in their face at the beach by macho bullies. Ideological toughness makes them feel strong, even tough. "I'm am not a wimp!" "I DEMAND an End to subsidies for others.....who aren't rich." "See! I'm a real man!"
They fear their emotional vulnerability, overcompensate with a strange form of masculinity: the ideological tough guy, "Bring it on." Since they fear women, they double down on rigidity.
 
 
+7 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 06:03
GOOD COMMENT.
 
 
+15 # rozgnatt 2012-08-28 04:42
In a sad way, it is comforting to read this article and the attendant comments. We need to know each other. The fact that the raging right is all about saving the unborn from abortion, while deconstructing the last vestage of a safety net for those babies and their mothers once they're born, lands the entire pro-fetus enterprise in the disenfranchisem ent of women category.

So what can we do besides talk to each other? We need to learn how to preach to more than 'the choir,' of which we're already members. We need to frame the content of this article's message in a more concise and factual manner and get it out beyond our own borders: good editing would get rid of all the "just's" and "really's" and other words which are meant to emphasize, but which only serve to sound immature and ineffectual.
I agree with Joris that hate is not going to play - rather we need to speak truth to misogyny. Work from facts, and from love for women and all humankind, which can't survive without our whole selves.
 
 
+13 # vegaspat 2012-08-28 05:32
The unanimous Declaration of the
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--Tha t to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, --That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it........
I think we are missing this. Plus the 'separation of church and state' would not be valid if the Republicans win. Mormons are notorious for subjugating women. Govt has been doing the same for years, making insurance pay for Viagara but not birth control. I could go on, but you get the idea. NO ONE should be able to tell you what to do with your body. How many men would be up in arms if we voted to castrate rapists? My husband wouldn't even let me get our male dog 'fixed' because it 'wasn't right'
 
 
+10 # bmiluski 2012-08-28 08:05
The Catholic Church is also notorious in its subjugation of women. Nuns are not allowed to serve mass nor are they allowed to decide church policies that would affect their lives. In the eyes of the Catholic Church women are second class citizens.
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:04
All Religions have this attitude. I believe the time has come where most Women are not taking to being cased as anything no less second class citizens.
The RedNeckers want to be so classified that is their way.
 
 
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:02
Too bad yur vet didn't tell him it can kill the animal. Same as female not getting spayed, it can kill her also.

Normons are just now being looked at but we have Many Religions that consider us the Lil Lady.
 
 
+9 # xpara 2012-08-28 06:13
The belief that the zygote, with a brain that might equal a paramecium, has legal rights that trump that of the woman, is a religious one. That's fine. You are entitled to your belief, even though it is not an issue that various scriptures deal with in an direct manner, and was not part of religious dogma in major religions until late in the 19th century. Again, fine. Instruct you flock accordingly and preach against what you feel is a sin. But the bottom line is it is not the government's business. Any law restricting choice should be struck down as not the government's business. That will not happen, of course, since this issue is a handy one for hypocrites, almost exclusively from the right, to yammer about to their political flock, enriching themselves with money, of course, and political power when enough people are conned into supporting them. I repeat, it is simple: before viability of a fetus which has developed into a living, breathing human being that can exist outside the womb, it is not the government's business to restrict reproductive matters by law.
 
 
+19 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 06:20
For the record, I'm COMPLETELY anti-abortion. So, I would tell my kids and my wife I don't want them to have one. It wouldn't be a problem because we all go to the same church and agree about it. I consider it a terrible sin.

For the record, my religious opinions HAVE NO PLACE in government (if the First Amendment to the Constitution means anything). It's none of my business what others do, because my only argument against their decision would be religious. I'm a Catholic, which ALSO means that I think NOTHING is a sin unless the person engaging in it BELIEVES it's a sin. The Pope even believes ATHEISTS can go to Heaven. THAT'S a lot more liberal than most religious nuts who want to impose their beliefs with the cooperation of the American government.

I really think abortion is a horrible (in fact, cardinal) sin. I also KNOW it's none of my business. It BECOMES my business (and EVERYONE ELSE'S who loves the concept of "America") when people try to impose their religious opinions on others.
 
 
+9 # Majikman 2012-08-28 08:35
Thank you, Billy Bob. If all religious people thought like you, I would not hold religion in the withering contempt and scorn that I do. I would like to view all religions with a detached benign "live and let live". Unfortunately, when certain religions want to impose their views on me, that becomes impossible.
 
 
+6 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 09:26
When religions you disagree with impose their views on you, you have to go into self-defense mode. Most Catholics don't agree with the far right. More Catholics are Democrats. The same can't be said about Evangelical Christians however.

Catholics should understand that state-sponsored religion wouldn't work in our favor anyway. Catholicism is a minority opinion.
 
 
+4 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:08
Personally as I Catholic, the women in my life never taught us to take back seats. Respect we had for nuns is because they chose to be teachers, not marry or bear I thought it wrong since our Religion depended on child making. But we are not out of the Dark Ages yet. However, women have a say, Nuns are getting their say. Many Religions like Mormon, Evangelical are not as ready to share Equality with Women. Yet our Creator Deemed us all Equal. My Government supposedly deemed us all Equal
Here we all are trying to decipher Equality.
 
 
+3 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 16:57
Good comments. I think the recent standoff between American nuns and bishops may be just the beginning. I can't wait until they finally allow women to be priests.

My mom is in her mid-80s, a VERY devout Catholic, pro-life AND pro-choice as I explained that I am, and follows the news closely.

She told me she read that many nuns are "bitter" about the fact that even deacons can do most of the things a priest can do, yet they can't.

Her response was, "WHY SHOULDN'T THEY BE BITTER ABOUT IT?" I had never even thought about it before that conversation. Deacons are primarily married men who came into the ministry after having other careers and children. My brother is one.

On the other hand, NUNS HAVE DEVOTED THEIR WHOLE LIVES to God from the beginning. Many of them have taken pretty extreme vows. Most of them are directly involved in the care for society's least fortunate. What more qualification could they possibly have for the priesthood.

I don't think the Catholic Church will ever become pro-choice (for Catholics). I don't mind that. I AM a Catholic. But, I GUARANTEE it will eventually be filled with women priests. And, when that day comes, expect MAJOR changes...
 
 
+6 # bmiluski 2012-08-28 10:20
Lets not forget the difference between spirituality and religion.
Spirituality is the search for enlightenment/knowledge.
Religion is the search for reward.
 
 
+3 # Regina 2012-08-28 11:00
You are late on this argument -- the Council of Bishops gets its oar into Congressional committee procedures on every issue they deem is theirs.
 
 
+4 # Billy Bob 2012-08-28 12:28
The Council of Catholic Bishops was also against the war in Iraq. It is also against the ryan/romney budget proposals, tax cuts for the rich, and trickle-down economics. Don't be confused by the right-wing media that only want you to hear half of the story.

ALSO, the Council of Catholic Bishops is a group who's members are only allowed to vote as much as any other Catholic.

I'm telling you, statistically speaking, Catholic PEOPLE are more likely to agree with the Democratic Party. REGARDLESS of what the Bishops say.

The Pope is also OPENLY opposed to the kind of so-called "free market" unregulated capitalism practiced in the U.S. In fact, his writing is OPENLY socialistic on the matter.

Repuglicans don't want to discuss any of that because it cancels out too much of their agenda.
 
 
0 # BeaDeeBunker 2012-08-28 11:32
Billy Bob,
Thank you for sharing your beliefs with us, and some of your personal, and private history; I respect you for that. For the record, can I test your resolve?

To quote:

"For the record, I'm COMPLETELY anti-abortion. So, I would tell my kids and my wife I don't want them to have one. It wouldn't be a problem because we all go to the same church and agree about it. I consider it a terrible sin."

When you say 'it wouldn't be a problem' what exactly do you mean?

If tragically, your wife was raped and got pregnant, she would carry it to term, correct? You would adopt this child, and give it your name, support it and love it forever, correct?

If she wanted to abort, you would support her, because she is an equal partner in the marriage, correct? Abortion is legal in America, and your wife is American, correct? Ergo, she has the 'right' to an abortion.

If, as you say, abortion is horrible, but none of your business, I can only conclude that you are Pro-Choice, as is your wife, correct?

I ask you to respond to these questions of resolve because you capitalized the word COMPLETELY, and you were on the record.
 
 
+4 # warkovision 2012-08-28 06:34
And larceny doesn't change the definition of earning money.
 
 
+10 # panhead49 2012-08-28 06:39
"Put another log on the fire;
Cook me up some bacon and beans;
Go out to the car, lift it up and change the tire;
Wash my socks and sew my old blue jeans.
You can fill my pipe and then go
fetch my slippers, cook me up another pot of beans;
Then put another log on the fire babe, and come and tell me why you're leaving me." Tom Paul Glaser wrote that if I recall correctly. Or it's a plank in the platform of Romney/Ryan 2012 (coffee hasn't kicked in yet).
 
 
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:09
Should make it into a song and use for them as sarcasm Turn it over to Paul Shafer
 
 
+10 # they said what? 2012-08-28 07:24
As to having the state assume responsibility for the children they might force a woman to bear ...

Communist Romania made abortion illegal. I think it staffed its security forces with children raised in "orphanages" filled with these unloved and unwanted children. The Romanian secret police were the worst in the Eastern Block, worse than KGB.

Studies have pointed out that the fall in crime in this country coincides with the legality of abortion - that crime statistics started dropping about 15-20 years after abortion was made legal.

I think love is one of the most important things in the world. I do not see much love in what Paul Ryan says, does or thinks.

And as many of the previous commenters have said, and as the article articulates, the central point is the attitude toward women reflected in comments by Paul Ryan and Todd Akin - that women are objects, vehicles for fetuses, and not fully human beings.

Margaret Atwood's THE HANDMAID's TALE lays out that territory pretty clearly. Even though it is a fantasy, it is a vivid reminder of where things can go if we let them.
 
 
+3 # Majikman 2012-08-28 08:38
If I'm not mistaken, didn't Hitler have Aryan "broodmare farms"?
 
 
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:12
Not sure but the mentality was there in many cases thru out history.

Perhaps the box faces that are missing are now being raised to bear. Missionaries steal children, seen it again in Haiti Crisis. We are not below any sin, we invent new ones all the time in the Name of Power,Greed
 
 
+3 # mkgd 2012-08-28 07:37
The so-called Christian Right should read Matthew 25:32-46. While I realize that many share my view that murder of the unborn is serious sin I also believe that the Pseudo-Christia n "Right"'s opposition to such things is mere window-dressing . It is a mass-marketing ploy that is designed to compel real Christians to support a demonic agenda that will lead this nation on a path of corporate ownership, devoid of Christ's Charity. It will lead us to a hell on earth and not the Kingdom of God. Like the Judas goats they are, the new GOP will lead us to the slaughter of damnation.
 
 
+1 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:13
You do not have to be led. You can Protest and if we do not then we obviously sanction them
 
 
+5 # Working Class 2012-08-28 08:14
Saw a great bumper sticker:

Romney/Ryan 2012
Rapists Deserve To Be Fathers Too
 
 
+12 # redrider 2012-08-28 08:57
If the pro-lifers actually demonstrated concrete concern for the mothers and babies born into or out of unfortunate circumstances including poverty, ignorance, rape and incest; instead of micro-managing their wombs, and were just as concerned after the child is born, I could understand the value they put on life. That would be consistent. But after the baby comes, where are they? The hypocrisy is deafening.
 
 
0 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:16
Where are they indeed. The Poor are no longer the batting cage for stupidity, for negligence.
The upper class have kids that have no brains, no feelings, just more clones Many middle class to are neglecting raising their children....Mal ls, Video Games, Pc whatever....too busy working extra jobs or just do not care.
 
 
0 # Trouper 2012-08-28 09:28
I think the all girl punk band from Russia " Pussy Riot" the political prisoners of the moment, should be released, brought to the United States and be performing the song by the Knack "My Sharona" Changed to "My Vagina" at the Republican Convention with these lyrics… That would be a huge kick in the balls of the male Patriarchy running this planet…

Ooh my little pretty one, pretty one.
When you gonna give me some time, Vagina
Ooh you make my motor run, my motor run.
Gun it comin' off the line Vagina
Never gonna stop, give it up.
Such a dirty mind. Always put it up for the touch
Republicanize My my my i yi woo. M M M My Vagina ...

Come a little closer huh, ah will ya huh.
Close enough to look inside, My Vagina
Keeping it a mystery gets to me
Running down my ownership of my , Vagina
Never gonna stop, give it up.
Such a dirty mind . Always put it up for the touch
Republicanize . My my my i yi woo. M M M My Vagina ...

When you gonna give it to me, give it to me.
It is just a matter of time Vagina
Is it just destiny, destiny?
Or is it just a game in my mind, Vagina ?
Never gonna stop, give it up.
Such a dirty mind . Always put it up for the touch
Republicanize . My my my i yi woo. M M M My Vagina …

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h3ADektyDhM
 
 
+6 # She Cee 2012-08-28 11:23
HYPOCRITES ALL!

These disgusting people hold dear the life of a fertilized egg and care not for the beautiful people who are dying in their ill-begotten wars.
 
 
+2 # KittatinyHawk 2012-08-28 13:24
As I replied I believe these men and women are clones. I believe them to be latent homosexuals with hatred and fear of women.

When a man has such disdain for a woman than she must know she only serves once purpose. Therefore she takes advantage thru stuff buying. She has a whole in her since her self has not been completed. She is a slave to a man who only wants someone to prove he is 'not' gay. When in fact, he is most certainly more gay than most homosexuals. His hatred of women leaves him powerless to be a companion, supporter. He uses her for his purpose.
I have not heard either Wives speak of their life, how great a man either is nor have I heard them discuss Women's Rights in their life, religion. I have not heard either of them speak of themselves at all. Cutesy bs but I do not see these women as role models. I see them as bimbos. Glad they had kids but I wonder what their kids are like, really like.
I see no feelings. I hear words...empty words, speeches written by someone for someone who will edit and take to the other one so they can have Mitt or Unreal read them. Words, black and white print.
There is no life left in the Candidates...th e few who have some shed of it.....
 
 
+2 # Billy Bob 2012-08-29 05:29
Just remember, the "Christian right" isn't the only political faction of Christians. It's the hypocritical faction. That's all.

THERE IS ALSO A CHRISTIAN LEFT.
 

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