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Kirk and  Kois report: "Since the shootings at Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Conn., on Dec. 14, we have been wondering how many people are dying from guns in America. The current answer is 306."

Christmas stockings with the names of shooting victims hang from a railing in the Sandy Hook village of Newtown, Conn. (photo: Julio Cortez/AP)
Christmas stockings with the names of shooting victims hang from a railing in the Sandy Hook village of Newtown, Conn. (photo: Julio Cortez/AP)

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+16 # RICHARDKANEpa 2012-12-30 08:51
Because we now argue gun control, Seniors might lose there cost of living increases and the poor their food stamps. The purpose of arguing hot button issues is so the rich can keep getting richer
 
 
-6 # readerz 2012-12-30 10:36
Rich gun manufacturers, that is.
Tell Congress to stop arguing and write real gun control legislation. Pass a Constitutional Amendment if necessary that explains the term "militia" was not meant to rebel against the government, but at the time as a way to save money for the government.
 
 
-2 # Dumbledorf 2012-12-30 09:03
The question should be asked, How many of these reported gun deaths, if accurate, are due to a Police Action, self-defense, suicide or criminal intent? To list all gun related deaths without explanation or attribution is very misleading and deceptive on its face.

How many gun related deaths occur in war zones currently maintained by the U.S. military? Doesn't that count too? Why not include this also in your data?

Did you know that more than 290 Americans die every day because of overt medical malpractice? See>>> http://beforeitsnews.com/opinion-liberal/2012/08/why-doctors-kill-more-people-than-gunds-2445244.html
Additionally, There have been at least 532 taser deaths by police in the U.S. For a list of names copy and paste here: http://electronicvillage.blogspot.com/2009/05/taser-related-deaths-in-united-states.html
We need facts, not hysteria!!!
 
 
+6 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 12:15
Sure am glad those 290 each day get to pick their own doctor - so they will NOT have to blame the government for their healthcare.
 
 
+16 # waltel 2012-12-30 13:31
I find it interesting how many down votes you got for asking a simple logical and clarifying question regarding these statistics. It's telling, isn't it, that all "gun deaths" are piled together and deemed bad. Meanwhile everyone is advocating that government use THEIR guns to go to war against innocent armed citizens in order to disarm them. How many, of the millions of innocent armed citizens, have used their guns to commit murder? And yet it is advocated that the government go to war against them in order to relieve them of their own means of self defense? Come on, people. The answer to crime is NOT to treat everyone in the nation as criminals. See the TSA? How's that working out for you?
 
 
+12 # MidwestTom 2012-12-30 19:00
Another interesting statistic In would like to see is how many gun deaths occur in No Gun areas, and in cities that have very strict gun control laws. The big three, Fort Hood, Aurora theater, and Newtown all occurred in advertised No Gun zones.
 
 
-4 # Texas Aggie 2012-12-30 20:25
In general the death rate from gun shots is several orders of magnitude higher in states with lenient gun control (Wyoming) than in those where guns are more tightly controlled (Massachusetts) . The other day I saw the statistics for the three states with the highest and lowest murder rates and their comparative gun control. The comparison wasn't even close.
 
 
+9 # edge 2012-12-31 05:47
Quoting Texas Aggie:
In general the death rate from gun shots is several orders of magnitude higher in states with lenient gun control (Wyoming) than in those where guns are more tightly controlled (Massachusetts). The other day I saw the statistics for the three states with the highest and lowest murder rates and their comparative gun control. The comparison wasn't even close.


This is PLAIN WRONG!

Most homicides are in Washington DC where we have about the tightest gun control anywhere, almost 3 times the national average!

Oh, your citing of Ma and Wy 2.01 and 2.02 homicides per 100k of population!
So your "several orders of magnitude higher" statement is ridiculous on its face!

Chicago just passed 500 homicides this year and the city laws are very strict.

http://factcheck.org/2012/12/gun-rhetoric-vs-gun-facts/

The term criminal relates to someone that breaks laws, so an intelligent person can understand that they will probably not abide by any new law written.
Criminals prey mainly on the weak, meaning if you can't/won't defend yourself you are much more likely to become a victim.

Ask yourself how many cops are robbed each year while in uniform?
Gee, he has a gun and knows how to use it...perhaps not a great target!!!
 
 
-8 # Texas Aggie 2012-12-30 20:30
He wasn't asking a "simple and clarifying question." He was trying to discredit the data. Otherwise he would have noted that people who attempt suicide are much more "successful" if they use a gun, but are more likely to get a second chance on life if they try something else. He wouldn't have brought up the non sequitur about military deaths or taser caused deaths or medical error deaths if he were really concerned about whether the data presented a false picture. In other words, he is out of line and deserved to be redlined.
 
 
-5 # tishado 2012-12-30 20:32
Quoting waltel:
I find it interesting how many down votes you got for asking a simple logical and clarifying question regarding these statistics. It's telling, isn't it, that all "gun deaths" are piled together and deemed bad. Meanwhile everyone is advocating that government use THEIR guns to go to war against innocent armed citizens in order to disarm them. How many, of the millions of innocent armed citizens, have used their guns to commit murder? And yet it is advocated that the government go to war against them in order to relieve them of their own means of self defense? Come on, people. The answer to crime is NOT to treat everyone in the nation as criminals. See the TSA? How's that working out for you?


I think the logical response would be to regulate these innocent civilians and they are not blamed for the bad people who kill with guns. Gun proliferation has not decreased gun violence. The parts of the country that have heavier gun regulations (not abolition) have fewer gun deaths per capita. Fighting against reasonable regulation leaves abolition as the only rational solution.
 
 
+8 # edge 2012-12-31 11:42
Quoting tishado:


I think the logical response would be to regulate these innocent civilians and they are not blamed for the bad people who kill with guns. Gun proliferation has not decreased gun violence. The parts of the country that have heavier gun regulations (not abolition) have fewer gun deaths per capita. Fighting against reasonable regulation leaves abolition as the only rational solution.


Factually not true!

Chicago very tough gun control and a lot of homicides!
Washington DC TRIPLE the national average in homicides and the toughest gun control in the Country!!

Connecticut rated 5 Stars by the Brady Foundation for gun control!!!

WISE UP, criminals prey on the weak, because they are cowards!!!!

In almost every case when these cowards are confronted with force they commit suicide. Had the Principal or school psychologist had a gun most of the deaths would probably have been prevented.
Both of those brave woman gave their lives trying to tackle the intruder!
 
 
+1 # rockieball 2013-01-02 08:11
Once you commit murder you are no longer a innocent citizen.
 
 
+3 # tishado 2012-12-30 20:27
Quoting Dumbledorf:
The question should be asked, How many of these reported gun deaths, if accurate, are due to a Police Action, self-defense, suicide or criminal intent? To list all gun related deaths without explanation or attribution is very misleading and deceptive on its face.
We need facts, not hysteria!!!


I do not see how this is hysteria if the conversation is about the lethality of having a lot of guns. Are there a bunch of good gun deaths? Are there good suicides by gun?

Your complaint makes the implicit suggestion that it is somehow misleading to ask the question of how many deaths there are by gun.
Auto deaths are reported that way. They do not usually break down by the intent of the driver.

When I hear that a certain number of people die by guns each day, I have the ability to judge whether that is significant and look into it more and into how this could be reduced or that it is not and I do not need to act.

As for your other data. It is interesting and points towards other issues that may need to be addressed. They are not related to gun deaths, however.
 
 
-2 # rockieball 2013-01-02 08:10
No, the question should be why do we allow this to happen at all? If we are to be called a civilized country then we must be civil to each other. you can argue that their have bee X amount of deaths due to taser's or cars or or anything else. But these things are regulated and you cannot just walk into a Walmart and buy a taser. You cannot just go to an auto dealer and buy a car without proof that you can drive one or have insurance and register it with the government and get a license to drive it. You can with guns. At gun shows and in mail order. Guns are designed and built to INJURE and KILL and are not designed for anything else.
 
 
+13 # Sensible1 2012-12-30 10:21
Spin these numbers any way you like, but one thing is sure; people who did not possess guns did not do the killing. In fact I'd say the odds are 100 percent in favor of those who do not own guns were not the killers. Could it be...that...may be, just maybe, guns and bullets from the guns are the actual cause of the deaths? Hey, I'm only guessing!
 
 
+4 # Notborn Yesterday 2013-01-01 19:34
Quoting Sensible1:
Spin these numbers any way you like, but one thing is sure; people who did not possess guns did not do the killing. In fact I'd say the odds are 100 percent in favor of those who do not own guns were not the killers. [...]


Sensible1, I don't know what you are saying here, as you seem to support both sides of this debate.But the above suggests you are in favour of outlawing gun possession and so are naively thinking those who kill - the criminals - will be magically dispossessed of them, handing them in like law-abiding citizens.

On your reasoning, all stabbing deaths are committed by those who own knives. So outlaw knives. Ditto axes, so oulaw axes. Ditto martial arts killers, so outlaw all forms of martial arts teaching and equipment. Ditto rope... etc etc.

What are we left with? Killers finding another way to kill. What do you think such a perrson could do to a classroom with a gallon of petrol and a box of matches?

"Things" are inanimate. With rare exceptions (eg mechanical breakdown) they don't kill. It is the killer that kills, and we must address the killer attitude, not the "thing" of choice.
 
 
+8 # readerz 2012-12-30 10:34
I heard an interview (an NPR show, maybe "Here and Now") with a doctor that said there used to be a log of gun and other violent death, but Bush stopped it. The first step toward stopping gun deaths is to log every single gun death in America.

Every doctor wants these statistics, because it is a medical problem (and many of those people who are shot and survive only do so because of major emergency surgery; doctors really want to stop this violence). Maybe it is no coincidence that the right-wing want to point to errors of doctors.

Doctors sometimes cannot save a life. Sometimes somebody is very sick, and a medicine causes an allergic reaction, or the person is too weak for surgery, but what was done was an attempt to save their lives. My husband is a cancer patient that does not tolerate his chemo well. I am not talking about discomfort, which is not bad, but blood counts, electrolyte imbalances, and brain swelling. He has a short treatment, and then has to back off, and when that happens, the cancer grows again. Yes, we have tried other things at the same time. The trouble is, doctors are not God, but they try to help.

Guns are not God either, but they have only one purpose: to kill. If a person hunts, they don't need handguns or automatic weapons. (Send in the National Guard to take care of the wild hog problem; the rest of us don't need automatic weapons.) People fall victim to guns much more often than squirrels or deer.
 
 
-4 # in deo veritas 2012-12-30 12:30
The real "wild hogs" are the gangs on the streets in human form. They should be the first to be eliminated by a real law enforcement system but the lawyers are alway in the way.
 
 
+10 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 13:13
Yeah,, damn that justice thing! I know a hoodie perp when I see one! I can tell by the rising hairs on the back of my neck and my itchy trigger finger.
 
 
+5 # MidwestTom 2012-12-30 19:05
The chief of Police in a 240,000 Midwest town told me that his force knows about 20 people who are doing crimes, mainly robberies, but they have not caught them in the act, or acquired enough evidence to arrest them. His estimate was that removing them from the street would cut robberies by 40 to 50 percent.
 
 
+5 # tishado 2012-12-30 20:34
Quoting MidwestTom:
The chief of Police in a 240,000 Midwest town told me that his force knows about 20 people who are doing crimes, mainly robberies, but they have not caught them in the act, or acquired enough evidence to arrest them. His estimate was that removing them from the street would cut robberies by 40 to 50 percent.


The findings I have heard frrom criminology is that this kind of problem is best addressed with intensive police presence working with neighborhood residents.
 
 
-4 # Texas Aggie 2012-12-30 20:51
So?
 
 
+1 # Doubter 2012-12-31 14:05
Ref. In Deo..
It is always easier to get things done under an absolute dictatorship. Is that what you advocate?
 
 
0 # rockieball 2013-01-02 08:15
It wasn't gangs that walked into Columbine, into Aurora, into the church in Oak creek Wisconsin, into Sandy Hook was it? But it was a self proclaimed head of neighborhood watch that shot a young boy because he was wearing hood and looked like a gang banger.
 
 
+2 # Notborn Yesterday 2013-01-01 21:50
Quoting readerz:
[...]People fall victim to guns much more often than squirrels or deer.



Readerz, I sympathise with your husdband's cancer problem. Unfortunately, chemo is usually not the answer - at least, noty for a permanent solution. In fact, statsistics tell us that an untreated cxancer sufferer has a greater chance of recovery than one who is treated conventionally by cut, burn or poison. Just briefly, we are many decades down the track after spending billions on cancer research, and stoill no cure. Or isthere? Follow the money and you'll understand why th alternative methods that see people permanently cured every day of the week are being suppressed. Study those. In particular, apriocot kernels and black salve. No-one can patent those, but they are both enormously effective. I've seen many cured.

Now, to your final paragraph: You said that the first step towards stopping gun deaths is to log every one of them. You also say that many more people than squirrels of dear fall vitim to guns. Where do you get your figures? Have you considered that squirrel, dear or any other animal NEVER used a gun for suicide? Yet gun-death statistics include suicides and gang related violence.

No, the first thing is to ensure statistical honesty, accuracy and completenes.
 
 
+11 # ConstitutionalSam 2012-12-30 11:21
Agree we need facts, not hysteria. Some additional statistical filters might be gang/non-gang, felon/non-felon , armed/unarmed, law enforcement/non -law enforcement, at work/not at work, and HEAVEN FORBID, the other statistical tool- Hispanic/not Hispanic, Black-African Ametican/not Black, Asian/not Asian, White-Caucasian /not White, Other and Alaskan/not Alaskan. Just saying....
 
 
+1 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 12:13
Problem is, such filters might show the incidence of whites suffering from home invasion and armed robbery might prove (relatively) insignificant and seriously diminish the market for heavy caliber, large magazine military killing machines necessary to make them feel safer or more capable of semi-meditated pre-vengeance.
 
 
+8 # ConstitutionalSam 2012-12-30 13:08
Quoting Bruce Gruber:
Problem is, such filters might show the incidence of whites suffering from home invasion and armed robbery might prove (relatively) insignificant and seriously diminish the market for heavy caliber, large magazine military killing machines necessary to make them feel safer or more capable of semi-meditated pre-vengeance.


WAIT! Let's not develop the facts because factual information might not support our stated position? Well, I guess it does make a position harder to defend if the facts show otherwise.

Silly me. I have always thought it is better to develop the facts and then take a position. And I have sometimes found a very subtle differnece between an historical perspective and a hysterical perspective.

I still believe in truth, justice and the American way. OK, maybe just truth.

....
 
 
+4 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 17:26
Wait! Wait! ... and I had greened your perceived witticism. Perchance does fact development, in fact, describe an art form designed to support intended positions ... but then I hope I have NOT missed the propinquity of tongue and cheek
 
 
+4 # ConstitutionalSam 2012-12-31 15:51
Wait! Wait! Wait! Your point is well taken. I used the wrong word to suggest research to seek the truth. "Develop the facts" can indeed be an art form to support a preconceived position. What I should have said is to seek the truth [not just develop the facts] and then formulate a position. I suspect, in fact, that this method likely exists only in the world of Unicorns.

As to the art form, it is alive an well in economists, corporate spokespeople, newscasters and bloggers. Oh, and politicians who do not use a fact that can be verified as true, but merely quote the "fact" often enough so that many will simply believe the fact to be true. An art form indeed. So for many, they have their positions and please do not confuse them with the facts.

As for my perceived witticism, it typically functions at about half. And the only way I know to avoid the propinquity of tongue and and cheek is to always keep your tongue stuck out. Several people have informed me this is perceived as quite rude and additionally makes me look silly. Go figure.
 
 
0 # Bruce Gruber 2013-01-01 09:02
Would that I could thumbs up with an exclamation point ...
 
 
+3 # in deo veritas 2012-12-30 12:27
regardless of statistical filters, we are still dealing with death. Once again it is likely that many of the perps are those gotten off by shysters or by the failure of the justice system. Capital punishment for the offenders will reduce the statistics but not prevent all the killings.
 
 
+9 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 13:43
Are we including this penalty for insurance companies, doctors and hospitals that decline treatments for the uninsured? And are law enforcement gangs included where a few dozen shots take out an alleged perp with no weapon discoverable "at the scene"? And what if Cheney's buddy had died when shot?

There are NO simple solutions to complicated problems. Nothing is purely black and white. All is swirling shades of gray.

Difficulties lie in separating cause and effect, goals and expectations, emotions and judgment.
 
 
+1 # Texas Aggie 2012-12-30 20:39
Why do you think it is likely "that many of the perps are those gotten off by shysters or by the failure of the justice system?" I can't think of a single one of the killers who got off because of a slick lawyer. The only one that even had a record spent time in jail.

The comments about having credible data are important if we want to solve the problem. Making wild guesses only serves to bolster our prejudices and solves nothing. But it does make you feel good, just like all the "tough on crime" types passing three strikes and you're out laws, or this Arpaio jerk whose district has shown an upsurge in real crime compared to surrounding districts.
 
 
0 # wrknight 2012-12-30 11:40
Good job!
 
 
+6 # Sandy 2012-12-30 11:55
I agree with dumbledorf that more details on the deaths would make the article more informative. I'm very liberal on most issues and against easy access to 'machine guns' but I happen to think 'guns' are not the real issue or problem we're dealing with here, any more than 'cars' are the problem in automotive related deaths. All the deaths are awful and extremely regretable, but how many people have died in car crashes during that same time period? Can we address that too? Let's try to keep all this in perspective as much as possible and not throw our rights out the window as we go about addressing the miriad of problems we face as a society. I for one would be fearful for our democracy such as it is, if only government reps (military, police, etc) and 'criminals' could access guns. So chipping away at our rights to own firearms worries me. Fixing the gross financial enequties, joblessness, hopelessness and our broken medical system, and see much of the senseless violence would disappear. In the short term, a huge effort at gun education might prove helpful. We used to sit thru movies on why not to use drugs when I was in Jr High, why not on proper respect for guns and gun safety? Other ideas: Expand required education on methods of gun safety before purchase, and subsidize the cost of gun safety gear. Maybe that could be tacked onto the homeland security budget. Let's face it, if America comes under attack, having additional people with firearms training might prove helpful.
 
 
-3 # in deo veritas 2012-12-30 12:23
Every one rersponsible for these gun deaths shoule be given the death sentence. Only by capital punishment will they be prevented from repeat offenses if released. Those opposed to this would likely not be if it were a member of their family that was a victim of gun vioience.If they are still opposed then they are victims of their own deluded "principles".
 
 
+7 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-30 13:17
An eye for an eye and a hand for a hand ...

and a dictator king to mete out the sentences.

Progress comes in tiny increments.
 
 
+5 # tishado 2012-12-30 20:38
Quoting in deo veritas:
Every one rersponsible for these gun deaths shoule be given the death sentence. Only by capital punishment will they be prevented from repeat offenses if released. Those opposed to this would likely not be if it were a member of their family that was a victim of gun vioience.If they are still opposed then they are victims of their own deluded "principles".


Wait! What about the high level of false conviction in death penalty cases?
 
 
0 # Doubter 2012-12-31 14:10
"Collateral Damage!"
(quotation marks mean irony)
 
 
+11 # Rich Austin 2012-12-30 12:33
Part I

Forget all the hysterical rants of the 2nd Amendment-given -only-to-the-U. S.-by-Jesus crowd.

Let’s look at some other figures.

According to a report published in the journal “Health Affairs”, 101,000 amenable mortalities occur in the U.S. each year because people are unable to get the medical care they need to stay alive.
http://www.pnhp.org/news/2008/january/united_states_has_wo.php

That’s over 1,250,000 lives since 9/11! Where are all the tears for those who died for lack of health care? That works out to 416 times the number who got murdered on 9/11. All the hype about the Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act leaves out that inconvenient truth. (While the PPACA is better than no improvements at all, it will still leave thousands to die from “amenable mortalities” each year. The GOP along with opportunistic Demopublicans love to recall the horrors of 9/11 every chance they get. When, however, they are asked about the death rate resulting from health care denial they go all glassy eyed.)

Washington will continue to sell us out for as long as we let them. Gun zealots will continue to act as if they are the sole protectors of freedom for as long as we let their voice drown out those of reason.

Bottom line: 1) Implement single payer health care; 2) Ban assault weapons and register every remaining gun after conducting thorough background checks.
 
 
0 # Texas Aggie 2012-12-30 20:54
Along the same lines, check out another take on the second amendment. It seems the right wing is selectively quoting John Locke to further their own agenda, contrary to what Locke actually said. Furthermore, they are deliberately trying to destroy civil society and replace it with the moral equivalent of "everyone for himself and the devil take the hindmost."

http://www.aljazeera.com/indepth/opinion/2012/12/20121226104857715225.html
 
 
+15 # Rich Austin 2012-12-30 12:35
Part II

Just remember the words of Frederick Douglas, and then act accordingly:

“Power concedes nothing without a demand. It never did and it never will. Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them, and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows, or both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress.”
 
 
+3 # readerz 2012-12-30 21:46
Frederick Douglas is right. Power concedes nothing. Because Montana Senator Baucus received almost all of his election campaign money from the health insurance industry, when he handed a law to Congress, it was written by the health insurance industry.

The only way for a real health care plan to be written is for people to say, Obamacare is "Not Enough" very loudly, and especially say:

1. Corporations are not persons, and may not make any campaign contributions.

2. Also set a limit on what any one person can contribute to a campaign, including the candidate and their family.

3. Then require media to set aside some time and space for candidates' positions.

These three things will prevent industries from writing our laws that we should have a say in, whether it is a rich gun manufacturers' lobby or the healthcare industry.
 
 
+3 # moby doug 2012-12-30 13:24
Of course Dumbledorf tries to change the subject. Wayne LaPierre did the same thing, pointing to mental health, the need for MORE guns, to ANYthing but the responsibility profit-mad gun manufacturers, lobbyists, sold-out politicians, and gun nuts have for the nation's unending bloodbath (10,000 homicides by gun per year) from a hail of lead.
 
 
+4 # mystie 2012-12-30 16:50
This is a base that people could come together to expand upon to do more research. Both sides of the coin should be happy for this as who knows what the results will end up being in a years time. I don't get the hostility. Why cant we all work toward this research to try and get to the bottom of this.
 
 
+3 # tishado 2012-12-30 20:41
Quoting mystie:
This is a base that people could come together to expand upon to do more research. Both sides of the coin should be happy for this as who knows what the results will end up being in a years time. I don't get the hostility. Why cant we all work toward this research to try and get to the bottom of this.


I would think this would be the case. The majority of the population agrees with a broad range of solutions that would help the problem. A very small number of people actively try to change the issue, throw tantrums, and stall any change in the hope that the public will forget.
 
 
+6 # JackB 2012-12-30 21:48
I love the hypocrisy of this board. Righteous & sanctimonious. Get those guns away from people. Liberals don't like guns so no one can have one.

The 321 deaths by gunshot since Newtown - how many were caused by an illegal weapon? Which one of the brilliant people giving "thumbs up" has a plan to address the illegal guns - you know - the ones that are responsible for over 90% of the murders?

Everyone pipes up on how & why guns should be taken from law abiding citizens. How about actually addressing the problem? Put the BS on hold & come up with a real solution.
 
 
-3 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-31 03:39
Keep your damned defense against your imagined threats from the hood and the meth addicts. Buy as much ammunition as you can afford to hold off the National Guard if you don't want to move to Switzerland or New Zealand.
BUT register the damn things including a ballistic test. Pass a FREE criminal, mental health, domestic violence, road rage, racist tendency identifying, local police administered survey. And if you own any firearm more destructive or concealable than a .22 rifle, then provide a signed, sworn acknowledgement of personal responsibility if your weapon is lost and/or used in any illegal act PLUS a $1,000,000 insurance rider or policy covering liability if any form of misuse attends your ownership of each and every weapon you own. Let the NRA and munitions manufacturers issue the insurance, they know how to use and invest the profits.

KEEP and BEAR your guns in the privacy of your home. Stay there if you cannot go out in public with the rest of us unless you carry a larger caliber than someone you fear you will encounter.

Attend monthly militia meetings under the auspices of your local law enforcement agency, Take personal responsibility for your decisions and BE A GOOD NEIGHBOR and CITIZEN.

Obviously, you think you are caring for ALL OF US.
 
 
-4 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-31 05:23
oh! Sorry about not addressing "illegal" guns (whether 90% responsible or not).

Any firearm encountered publicly that does not meet the above-described characteristics of personal responsibility MUST be seized by public safety authorities with an effective fee system. Return to owners occurs when they are proven consistent with the RULES of responsibility. If sweeps of local taverns and city street corners must be combined with metal detectors at public events to preserve and protect 'public order', so be it. We have license and insurance auto checks, why not firearms?
Recidivist offenders of the rules can be subjected to random parole requirements and privilege removal. Criminalization is hardly desirable except where criminal acts are extant, but weapons violations - like drunk driving - should imply a threat to public safety and might reasonably expect similar results.
 
 
0 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-31 06:51
Many (but not ALL) concerned citizens - including liberals, populists, conservatives AND NRA members - are NOT remotely interested in rounding up everyone's guns. But MOST are deeply concerned about the cultural character of a large segment of our citizenry who popularize the fiction that the GOVERNMENT (like Pogo's tongue-in-cheek admonishment) is US and, therefore, WE are the enemy.

Hiding behind the 2nd Amendment to promote paranoia and profits neglects consideration that the Founders produced "equality and freedom and RIGHTS" ONLY for white, male land owning decision makers. The rest of the American Dream has been stumbled into, off-times grudgingly, and always after protracted objection from those white, male, capital dominating 'special' interests.

THAT, to me, is America's greatness ... the ability to grow, mature and expand the concepts which we revolutionized. "Conserving" a past which only scratched the surface of humanity's awareness and capacity for thinking - as a species - severely limits our potential. GUNS do not represent our strength.
 
 
+3 # Pancho 2012-12-30 22:03
Gohmert doesn't need evidence to claim any weird notion he has is "fact."

I've often wondered if he or Steve King from Iowa was the stupidest man in Congress.
 
 
+6 # Martintfre 2012-12-31 09:40
How many people have been killed by their own governments after being disarmed by them?

feel free to reference Pol Pot, Adolph Hitler, Mao
 
 
+6 # Martintfre 2012-12-31 09:42
How many were killed because our government giving secretly guns to drug lords with the fast and furious escapade?
 
 
+1 # Bruce Gruber 2012-12-31 09:49
Had some thoughts I edited after being published that responded to JackB's challenge. Hope they weren't lost ...
 
 
+2 # NanFan 2012-12-31 11:33
This is staggering and so sad that we HAVE to keep track of these atrocities.
 
 
-3 # flippancy 2013-01-01 16:49
Are you aware of the reason we even have the second amendment? It's not so people can protect themselves from the government, it's because the government in a time of a miniscule standing army and no will to support one wanted the people to help protect the government.

It was instituted as a result of Shay's rebellion wwhich almost toppled the nascent government shortly after it's birth. George Washington was so stunned by the action that he took command of the small army and defeated the rebellion and that was why he decided to become part of the constitutional convention.

Guns were never intended as personal protectionm,and anyone who tells you that they were uis an out and out liar or an ignorant twit.

In the 30s the SCOTUS ruled that the National Guard was the "well regulated militia" called for in the amendment, whch means you have NO right to own a gun. I don't advocate taking them away but there do need to be controls on them.

The reason there are so many shootings in places like D.C. is that there are no effective controls on guns and bad people have no problem getting them.
 
 
+1 # RICHARDKANEpa 2013-01-02 15:12
Hot Button Issues get divided into left and right. Immigration being linked with abortion is a tittivate link up.

Now the right part of the hot button divide will get new energy from gun control fears.
I was so hopeful,

http://readersupportednews.org/pm-section/78-78/15338-the-real-story-of-barack-obama
 
 
+2 # FDRva 2013-01-02 21:13
If only the President's commitment to gun control included removing NATO guns from Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, Syria, etc, etc.

I suspect that far more than 306 people in Afghanistan, alone, have died of gun violence--endor sed by the President-- in the same period.

But that is OK, right?

For the crossword puzzle fans among us--a five letter word for 'Hypocrite' beginning with "O."
 
 
0 # FDRva 2013-01-02 21:29
This President has much to fear from his powerful putative friends--partic ularly now that his salesmanship on Wall Street's behalf has gotten him reelected.

In the political, corporate and intelligence world Barry Obama may have just made himself 'disposable.'

And at a time when much is at stake.

As a strong supporter of the US Constitutional system, I urge a beefing up of the Secret Service to face all contigencies.
 
 
+2 # ChadJackson 2013-01-04 10:47
Ok, new here, but here's my two cents
One, I AM an avid supporter of the second amendment. I believe in stricter gun laws, that law abiding citizens should be able to carry, own, possess, utilize (when necessary) the use of a firearm. The deaths that have happened with firearms people blame the guns. Maybe some need a refresher course on how a gun works. The gun, is loaded with bullets, the gun is aimed at someone, and someone pulls the trigger. The gun doesn't just lift itself out of a holster or out of someone's safe and fire itself at something or someone. If you want to talk about gun bans, let's look at statistics. Switzerland boasts the worlds LOWEST crime rates. Why EVERY person in Switzerland has a gun, is allowed to OPENLY carry it, and is protected by castle law (a law that protects a homeowner in self defense of his property, family or personal life from using lethal force against an intruder). Do we need stricter gun laws in the USA.. by all means! But, you take the law abiding citizen's ability to protect himself against a CRIMINAL with a gun, whose going to save that person.. you? the government? the LEO's? Isn't every person in congress protected by a secret service member WITH A GUN? Whose going to protect them now? All I am saying is this, over 70% of gun deaths every year are due to suicide the CDC reports this every year. Yet guns are to blame for every violent crime in America. Yet more are killed by bats and fists. let's outlaw those too
 
 
+2 # ChadJackson 2013-01-04 10:56
I am a firm believe in the second amendment. Lets look at statistics, over 360,000 people are killed by doctors every year due to malpractice, misdiagnosis, etc. More than 70% of ALL crimes resulting in deaths are caused by blunt force objects, knives, and bare hands. Over 70% of gun deaths are SUICIDES (Reported by the CDC) Now guns don't just up and point and shoot by themselves do they? Taking the rights of Americans to keep and bear arms is retarded for many reasons. The main one being, you take the law abiding citizens gun, who protects them from the criminal that DIDN'T have a miraculous change of heart and turn in their gun.. you? the police? the government? Let's look at the country with the lowest crime rate in the world.. Switzerland. Over 97% of the population there owns AND openly carries a firearm. Interesting isn't it? Look at some of the few states that allow open carry, their crime rate is among the lowest in the country. If a criminal KNOWS he is going into a place that is accepting of the second amendment, his want/desire to commit a violent crime reduces significantly. I am NOT saying stricter gun laws aren't in order. By all means bring them on it needs to be done, BUT taking the ability from the law abiding citizen and making/allowing him to be a target to the criminal is ridiculous and absurd. ANY government thinking disarming its citizens is going to stop gun violence, well.. I think it is starting to show here what type of government thatis
 
 
-1 # Blue in a Red State 2014-05-31 07:18
If the GOP truly cared about the deaths of Americans, they would investigate the deaths of Americans by Americans on American soil and actually do something about it. Unfortunately, it's not in the GOP's best financial interest to end gun violence and they will continue to waste taxpayer dollars and precious legislating time investing (for the 9th time) the albeit tragic deaths of 4 Americans on foreign soil committed by foreigners who want nothing more than to kill Americans on foreign soil.
 
 
0 # bob8576 2014-06-10 21:40
Here is a crazy fact, I used this sites statistics on gun fatalities in Texas. I then pulled the drunk driving fatalities statistics for Texas from MADD website. Guess what...More DWI deaths in the same time frame. I think we should ban cars so we don't have any more drunk drivers. Oh that's right, you have a car and wont give it up to "save innocent lives."
 

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